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About Me
I am a licensed real estate sales associate in a resort area of Long Island. I prefer not to divulge my exact location and identity because, due to the nature of the discussions here, I do not want to violate my fiduciary duty of confidentiality. I am not looking for referrals either from agents or the public, and am just here to share whatever knowledge and experience I possess that can help prospective buyers and my fellow agents.
My Q&A
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J R's Questions (5)
J R's Answers (936)
J R answered:
id look into dropping 200K in aggressive growth funds of other investment, look at a 10 year time line, compare
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Because we all know that's a guaranteed ROI. @@
Personally, I would put down as much as I could afford to and live debt free on my home if possible if this were my primary residence. No one knows, well except teachers and other government employees, what their future job situationis going to be. If he doesn't fall into that employment field, he should go for it.
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Because we all know that's a guaranteed ROI. @@
Personally, I would put down as much as I could afford to and live debt free on my home if possible if this were my primary residence. No one knows, well except teachers and other government employees, what their future job situationis going to be. If he doesn't fall into that employment field, he should go for it.
J R answered:
If I could not find a home I liked for $XX in a town I would like to live in--which I must consider pretty nice, or I wouldn't want to live there--what would be my chances of finding a home for the same price in a town that was "nicer or better"?
J R answered:
JR I am also a Realtor and don't try to twist statistics. For the country as a whole that statistic is correct.
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For the country as a whole the median price is also about 215,000. Here it's $440,000. Your point?
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For the country as a whole the median price is also about 215,000. Here it's $440,000. Your point?
--foreclosures now account for at least 1/3 home sales, according to NAR chief economist Lawrence Yun (!)
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This is going to depend on where you're looking. Here they are no where NEAR 1/3. They're under 1%.
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This is going to depend on where you're looking. Here they are no where NEAR 1/3. They're under 1%.
Does this *necessarily* mean that the value of my home has also fallen for the past six months? Or could it be that *my home's value* hasn't changed, but the C-S Index is merely reflecting the fact that sellers are slow to realize price losses?
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Of course it means your home's value has changed. All the boats fall with the tide. You just got lucky. It happens.
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Of course it means your home's value has changed. All the boats fall with the tide. You just got lucky. It happens.
Richard, obviously you don't believe you can trust any Realtor, so I would suggest that you never use one, and if you do end up using one that you think is violating the COE then report them.
I think you dislike realtors because you're a hateful little man. Otherwise why would you enjoy telling them that so often?
JR and I were both told not to discuss any missives that either of us sent to each other publicly, as a condition for unbanning from the site.
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I never sent a "missive" to you, dear. It was a one way profane street.
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I never sent a "missive" to you, dear. It was a one way profane street.
So please don't pretend that it's "fantasy-land" to point out that a lot of Realtors will always tell you that it's a good time to buy, just so long as it isn't a Realtor-free owner to owner transaction. You're the one in fantasy-land, JR. Wake up.
(But hey, thanks for re-proving my point that many Realtors are dishonest and that they hate their clients. I love it when you post, because you do more damage to the Realtor brand than I ever could.)
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So now we've gone from "routinely" to "a lot"? Which is it Richard? And how do I prove your non "point" that realtors are dishonest. I'm here agreeing with a lot of you that prices are coming down etc etc.
Face it: We all know you hate realtors and I know it particularly well since I've received your emails.
(But hey, thanks for re-proving my point that many Realtors are dishonest and that they hate their clients. I love it when you post, because you do more damage to the Realtor brand than I ever could.)
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So now we've gone from "routinely" to "a lot"? Which is it Richard? And how do I prove your non "point" that realtors are dishonest. I'm here agreeing with a lot of you that prices are coming down etc etc.
Face it: We all know you hate realtors and I know it particularly well since I've received your emails.
Or maybe, just maybe...
He walked into an office full of RE agents and shot that one and only one RE agent in an act of premeditated murder as the story suggests and the police indicate.
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Obviously he had a target, but he was a kook. So you're somehow justifying this shooting because a kook thought he was wronged.
He walked into an office full of RE agents and shot that one and only one RE agent in an act of premeditated murder as the story suggests and the police indicate.
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Obviously he had a target, but he was a kook. So you're somehow justifying this shooting because a kook thought he was wronged.
JR: How can you say that the occupation of the victim was incidental? Unless you were the murderer in this case, you can't.
Zack pointed out, quite correctly, that many RE agents lie and distort the probability of a home reaping significant financial rewards, and as such, these lies and distortions may have incited the attack.
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Excuse me. "Zack pointed out CORRECTLY?" that many RE agents lie and distort? You guys are in fantasy land, and in your fantasy land, the realtor is the perpetrator just by the act of breathing.
Zack pointed out, quite correctly, that many RE agents lie and distort the probability of a home reaping significant financial rewards, and as such, these lies and distortions may have incited the attack.
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Excuse me. "Zack pointed out CORRECTLY?" that many RE agents lie and distort? You guys are in fantasy land, and in your fantasy land, the realtor is the perpetrator just by the act of breathing.
I think that at some point there has got to be a little "buyer beware" here. I have a few friends that are realtors, and despite my negative view of the housing market, they believe it will come back in the next 6 months. I argue until I am blue in the face, but I can't win. And it is not because these guys are trying to put one over on me, but because they are just very optimistic about the market and have all the faith in the world that homes purchased today will go up in value.
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And I would point out, I have done listing presentations for MANY owners who TRULY believe things are going to turn around shortly (after the election, in the spring–––more like when pigs fly out of my ... well) and we should list their home at whatever inflated fantasy price they have in mind. They MUST believe this. So it isn't only some realtors who are optimistic, I'd say sellers are even moreso.
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And I would point out, I have done listing presentations for MANY owners who TRULY believe things are going to turn around shortly (after the election, in the spring–––more like when pigs fly out of my ... well) and we should list their home at whatever inflated fantasy price they have in mind. They MUST believe this. So it isn't only some realtors who are optimistic, I'd say sellers are even moreso.
The point of the article was to make people aware that this has become a contentious point between home buyer/home seller/RE agent/lender.
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Obviously the homeowner had a mental problem and if he had bought a FSBo he would have tracked him down and killed him, or maybe just shot the next guy who cut him off at a stop sign. The occupation of the victim is incidental.
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Obviously the homeowner had a mental problem and if he had bought a FSBo he would have tracked him down and killed him, or maybe just shot the next guy who cut him off at a stop sign. The occupation of the victim is incidental.
From Nicholas' article: Tague told WOOD-TV in Grand Rapids that Johnson believed that VanderStelt took advantage of him in a real estate deal.
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Nicholas, what is the purpose of posting this article? The man's house went down in value, no one was taken advantage of in a real estate deal. Obviously inflammatory post.
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Nicholas, what is the purpose of posting this article? The man's house went down in value, no one was taken advantage of in a real estate deal. Obviously inflammatory post.
This guy in a tie thinks that the worst is yet to come due to the credit crunch.
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Not sure if this is making the same point :), but I think the worst is yet to come when the 3 year ARMs readjust in Aug since that was when they were obtained, at the height of the market.
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Not sure if this is making the same point :), but I think the worst is yet to come when the 3 year ARMs readjust in Aug since that was when they were obtained, at the height of the market.
JR, isn't that the same point that Nicholas is making? Because inventory is so high, it indicated more than just a down market, it also indicates that the inventory will not be absorbed without sellers initiating a mark down in prices.
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My personal opinion is that the inventory is not going to be absorbed, I think much of it will be taken off the market when sellers don't realize their prices. Assuming they just stay on the market yes, the inventory will stay high unless they come down. I think at some point there will be a LACK of inventory because prices are going to come down and people who don't have to are just not going to sell. Right now there is really a lack of inventory IMO because I don't consider ridiculously high priced houses to be for sale. My experience has been the owners do not counter realistic offers. So I no longer show overpriced listings with the hopes that realistic offers will generate a counter.
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My personal opinion is that the inventory is not going to be absorbed, I think much of it will be taken off the market when sellers don't realize their prices. Assuming they just stay on the market yes, the inventory will stay high unless they come down. I think at some point there will be a LACK of inventory because prices are going to come down and people who don't have to are just not going to sell. Right now there is really a lack of inventory IMO because I don't consider ridiculously high priced houses to be for sale. My experience has been the owners do not counter realistic offers. So I no longer show overpriced listings with the hopes that realistic offers will generate a counter.
but extremely high inventory (10+ months) means something totally different.
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IMO the extremely high inventory rates are due to unrealistic sellers. And I don't mean people who won't accept lowballs, I mean people priced 50,000 to 100,000 over what they should be who don't even counter.
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IMO the extremely high inventory rates are due to unrealistic sellers. And I don't mean people who won't accept lowballs, I mean people priced 50,000 to 100,000 over what they should be who don't even counter.
Kallen, stop spamming, please!
There have been reports of people getting loans who are in jail. There have also been reports of people getting 720,000$ loans who make 14,000$ dollars a year. I am giving you a first hand report of a builder who continued to leverage himself ultimately to his collapse.
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Remember the 80s, when credit card companies would send your 5 year old or your dog a credit card? When they just MAILED them out unsolicited? That practice left record bankruptcies in it's wake. I think it's pretty well established the banks have royally screwed up even worse this time. Banks are pretty greedy. That's why they put ridiculous penalties on late credit card payments. Remember when they first came out with ATMs and it was going to be SO MUCH CHEAPER because now the bank didn't have to hire TELLERS to give you their money? What do they charge you now to use an ATM card....a dollar or more?
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Remember the 80s, when credit card companies would send your 5 year old or your dog a credit card? When they just MAILED them out unsolicited? That practice left record bankruptcies in it's wake. I think it's pretty well established the banks have royally screwed up even worse this time. Banks are pretty greedy. That's why they put ridiculous penalties on late credit card payments. Remember when they first came out with ATMs and it was going to be SO MUCH CHEAPER because now the bank didn't have to hire TELLERS to give you their money? What do they charge you now to use an ATM card....a dollar or more?
Sounds like someone is stretching the truth a bit somewhere!
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Victor, maybe his builder friend was also a fisherman. :)
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Victor, maybe his builder friend was also a fisherman. :)
I have another personal story for you.
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Spot builders typically leverage their principal residences to raise capital. My neighbor does it. However, I'd had to ask when exactly he was able to borrow 125% of the value of his residence and what bank did it. My neighbor has always complained that the bank only lent him 80% of the value of his home.
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Spot builders typically leverage their principal residences to raise capital. My neighbor does it. However, I'd had to ask when exactly he was able to borrow 125% of the value of his residence and what bank did it. My neighbor has always complained that the bank only lent him 80% of the value of his home.
Is this smart or is it fraud??
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Smart? I believe the word for it is immoral.
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Smart? I believe the word for it is immoral.
BEST ANSWER
JR,
I'm sorry that it is hard for you to believe that there are unscrupulous people in this world. We are dealing with the very real and serious consequences that they bring.
I am not sure how unlikely this type of event is and I hope that it is isolated but it still happened. I provided supporting information that revealed the thoughts and feelings of other RE agents regarding appearance, a clear motivator for deception.
You on the other hand have based your argument on "nuh-uhh" and blindly pretend that things like this don't happen in your industry.
Did I somehow hit a nerve with you? Maybe it was back when you said that you couldn't change your commission rates when I debated with you there. Turns out Federal Law prohibits price fixing which makes it illegal to fix RE commission rates. Just because you don't want to doesn't mean you can't.
Please do try to be civil and add value; three post containing almost all of my words and "BLAH BLAH BLAH" added by you don't make for good arguments or add value.
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I don't dispute there are unscrupulous people. I don't dispute you should "dress for success." I dispute your unbelievable story.
JR,
I'm sorry that it is hard for you to believe that there are unscrupulous people in this world. We are dealing with the very real and serious consequences that they bring.
I am not sure how unlikely this type of event is and I hope that it is isolated but it still happened. I provided supporting information that revealed the thoughts and feelings of other RE agents regarding appearance, a clear motivator for deception.
You on the other hand have based your argument on "nuh-uhh" and blindly pretend that things like this don't happen in your industry.
Did I somehow hit a nerve with you? Maybe it was back when you said that you couldn't change your commission rates when I debated with you there. Turns out Federal Law prohibits price fixing which makes it illegal to fix RE commission rates. Just because you don't want to doesn't mean you can't.
Please do try to be civil and add value; three post containing almost all of my words and "BLAH BLAH BLAH" added by you don't make for good arguments or add value.
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I don't dispute there are unscrupulous people. I don't dispute you should "dress for success." I dispute your unbelievable story.
Dear Seller:
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Yet another reason why real estate agents exist. To keep one or sometimes two people who behave in such a manner to totally alienate the other apart.
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Yet another reason why real estate agents exist. To keep one or sometimes two people who behave in such a manner to totally alienate the other apart.
http://www.famousagents.com/forum/right-brokerage/306-office…
Quote --
"After several years of observation, I have learned that you can tell how successful an agent is by the way they dress."
"Women - The more successful they are, the dressier they get. You know, from the 2nd hand stores "fake it 'til you make it" look to the time when they might actually refer a client to someone else so they don't have to cancel their shopping day when the new Prada line comes out."
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BLAH BLAH BLAH.
Still not what you said. You're changing the subject. Why don't you just quit?
Quote --
"After several years of observation, I have learned that you can tell how successful an agent is by the way they dress."
"Women - The more successful they are, the dressier they get. You know, from the 2nd hand stores "fake it 'til you make it" look to the time when they might actually refer a client to someone else so they don't have to cancel their shopping day when the new Prada line comes out."
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BLAH BLAH BLAH.
Still not what you said. You're changing the subject. Why don't you just quit?
In case this is confusing for you Real Estate agents here are more agent comments about dress code including vehicles.
http://activerain.com/blogsview/116734/Do-Clothes-Make-The
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Don't change the subject. Your post was not about HOW an agent SHOULD dress, but about a broker who took a drug addict and set her up with a BMW and loaned them expensive jewelry and clothes "to make sales." She was then "fired".
Your post is below:
Ex-Sister-in-Law (Brother's previous wife), who has known problems with drugs, becomes a Real Estate agent in 2005. The RE broker sets her up with a BMW and loans her expensive jewelry and clothes to make sales. Recently ,because of the slump, the broker asked for the BMW and other material loans to be returned and she was fired. Now she cleans the houses that she was showing to earn a living. She is qualified to do little else.
http://activerain.com/blogsview/116734/Do-Clothes-Make-The
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Don't change the subject. Your post was not about HOW an agent SHOULD dress, but about a broker who took a drug addict and set her up with a BMW and loaned them expensive jewelry and clothes "to make sales." She was then "fired".
Your post is below:
Ex-Sister-in-Law (Brother's previous wife), who has known problems with drugs, becomes a Real Estate agent in 2005. The RE broker sets her up with a BMW and loans her expensive jewelry and clothes to make sales. Recently ,because of the slump, the broker asked for the BMW and other material loans to be returned and she was fired. Now she cleans the houses that she was showing to earn a living. She is qualified to do little else.
My story was one of a RE agent that was loaned these things to look successful but lacked any real skills.
These types of quotes lend a lot to the motivation of the RE broker who engaged in such practice. As a RE agent you should out drive, dress, and accessorize your clientel but not by too much or you risk looking sloppy.
Does it matter that she didn't have enough of her own capital to do that? Nope, someone can loan it to you, kind of like staging a house except your staging an underqualified real estate agent.
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Your story was extremely unlikely, even ludicrous, and no matter how much you explain the motivation, it's still unbelievable. Yes, agents can borrow clothing, anyone can, but your story is unlikely.
These types of quotes lend a lot to the motivation of the RE broker who engaged in such practice. As a RE agent you should out drive, dress, and accessorize your clientel but not by too much or you risk looking sloppy.
Does it matter that she didn't have enough of her own capital to do that? Nope, someone can loan it to you, kind of like staging a house except your staging an underqualified real estate agent.
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Your story was extremely unlikely, even ludicrous, and no matter how much you explain the motivation, it's still unbelievable. Yes, agents can borrow clothing, anyone can, but your story is unlikely.
The story of the RE agent that I gave below is a true story. She just lost her job in this last month. I won't give her name, go find your own RE agency to sue.
As for why it shows you shouldn't buy in this market really needs to be tied back to the situation that led many to make loans they couldn't support. Image is very important in sales. If you can convince your buyer that "everyone" has items like these and they are the only one without one then the buyer will feel pressure to conform.
By pretending that everyone has expensive cars, clothes, and jewelry they are presenting an image that buyers should have these things too.
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Keep digging that hole deeper Nicholas. It's bad enough you repeat this story which is so patently false it's ludicrous. "By pretending every has expensive cars, etc they are presenting an image the buyer should have these things too"? So how will the buyer get these things by buying a house? Sounds as if the buyer should become a real estate agent, LOL. Either give us the details of the name of the agency or lose your credibility right now. Trust us (although obviously you don't trust r.e. agents), this stuff just does not happen.
As for why it shows you shouldn't buy in this market really needs to be tied back to the situation that led many to make loans they couldn't support. Image is very important in sales. If you can convince your buyer that "everyone" has items like these and they are the only one without one then the buyer will feel pressure to conform.
By pretending that everyone has expensive cars, clothes, and jewelry they are presenting an image that buyers should have these things too.
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Keep digging that hole deeper Nicholas. It's bad enough you repeat this story which is so patently false it's ludicrous. "By pretending every has expensive cars, etc they are presenting an image the buyer should have these things too"? So how will the buyer get these things by buying a house? Sounds as if the buyer should become a real estate agent, LOL. Either give us the details of the name of the agency or lose your credibility right now. Trust us (although obviously you don't trust r.e. agents), this stuff just does not happen.
Brent - To take things a step further I think you place the blame on the ratings agencies that marked these mortgage pools as AAA and the banks/hedge funds/pension funds that bought them.
However, I also place blame on any sales people that lie and mislead their clients to increase their personal wealth.
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Sales people who lie and mislead are bad. Do you think a salesperson can force someone to buy a house? As much as some of you like to compare us to used car salesman (as a complement of course, as Elvis points out), I'm relatively certain it's easier to push someoneinto buying an item that comes with a 200 monthly payment than a 3,000 monthly payment. I may be in the minority but I blame the public who took out these loans. I had them pushed on me by my bank (Chase) and told them no way, what happens after I pay interest for 10 years? "You REFINANCE!" Uh huh. Right. The banks are to fault for handing out these loans but the ultimate blame lies with the people who signed the loans.
However, I also place blame on any sales people that lie and mislead their clients to increase their personal wealth.
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Sales people who lie and mislead are bad. Do you think a salesperson can force someone to buy a house? As much as some of you like to compare us to used car salesman (as a complement of course, as Elvis points out), I'm relatively certain it's easier to push someoneinto buying an item that comes with a 200 monthly payment than a 3,000 monthly payment. I may be in the minority but I blame the public who took out these loans. I had them pushed on me by my bank (Chase) and told them no way, what happens after I pay interest for 10 years? "You REFINANCE!" Uh huh. Right. The banks are to fault for handing out these loans but the ultimate blame lies with the people who signed the loans.
Nicolas, do you think anyone other than the most virulent agent haters will believe this story
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JR, I think the more important question is "do you think anyone other than the most virulent agent haters will care about this story". What is the point here? That someone gave your former sister-in-law a chance, tried to do what they could to help her success, and in the end it didn't work out? There are many real estate professionals being fired in this market, just as there are many carpenters, electricians, loan officers, etc...
Is someone really going to be able to use that story to help answer the question "Why should someone buy in this market?"
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For one thing real estate agents are independent contractors. They aren't "fired". An fancy car and jewels don't make sales... oh for goodness' sake, the story is just plain ridiculous.
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JR, I think the more important question is "do you think anyone other than the most virulent agent haters will care about this story". What is the point here? That someone gave your former sister-in-law a chance, tried to do what they could to help her success, and in the end it didn't work out? There are many real estate professionals being fired in this market, just as there are many carpenters, electricians, loan officers, etc...
Is someone really going to be able to use that story to help answer the question "Why should someone buy in this market?"
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For one thing real estate agents are independent contractors. They aren't "fired". An fancy car and jewels don't make sales... oh for goodness' sake, the story is just plain ridiculous.
The RE broker sets her up with a BMW and loans her expensive jewelry and clothes to make sales.
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Nicolas, do you think anyone other than the most virulent agent haters will believe this story?
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Nicolas, do you think anyone other than the most virulent agent haters will believe this story?
Hyuflg, glad you decided to take down your post. Of course you can never really "take back" anything you have published on the internet--it can all be traced--but it was probably a step in the right direction. Just so you know, I have kept all of your most heinous posts under the various names--from your "KILL LAWYERS" posts to the comments about my family members dying painful deaths to your most recent comments on what should be done to our nation's President. You've really done your profession proud (from your other posts I've read from different question threads, it's clear you actually are a REALTOR).
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Amazing. THere's no doubt in your mind, is there?
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Amazing. THere's no doubt in your mind, is there?
And you can lose a lot more that way.
Pearl - In your example of owning a house for 10 years, and selling it for a 75% increase, you would have made less than 6% annually - that's a) FAR better than housing has done historically b) worse than the S&P 500 has done historically.
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Assuming had actually HAD the cash to begin with to PUT into the market.
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Assuming had actually HAD the cash to begin with to PUT into the market.
JR said “John, many buyers seem to espouse communism also, when they cite affordability ratios.”
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John: Simply put, for a given market the median income should support the median priced house, short of extraordinary measures in leveraging that asset. If not, then sit back and watch the wonders of the free-market at work. Communism? Far from it.
JR: Of COURSE not! Now you're making YOUR point!
John: Real estate bears aren’t advocating government intervention in the real estate market, either on the home-price side or the income side through income subsidies or the like.
JR: Oh but they are. They are advocating locking in lower rates locked in for--what word can I possibly use to describe them here that isn't offensive?--- those poor innocent people who took low rate adjustable mortgages and had their arms twisted to sign home equity loans that now put the houses they paid 225,000 for in 2001 100,000 under water.
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John: Simply put, for a given market the median income should support the median priced house, short of extraordinary measures in leveraging that asset. If not, then sit back and watch the wonders of the free-market at work. Communism? Far from it.
JR: Of COURSE not! Now you're making YOUR point!
John: Real estate bears aren’t advocating government intervention in the real estate market, either on the home-price side or the income side through income subsidies or the like.
JR: Oh but they are. They are advocating locking in lower rates locked in for--what word can I possibly use to describe them here that isn't offensive?--- those poor innocent people who took low rate adjustable mortgages and had their arms twisted to sign home equity loans that now put the houses they paid 225,000 for in 2001 100,000 under water.
John, many buyers seem to espouse communism also, when they cite affordability ratios.
Las Vegas: Their arguments for open access say one thing but their intentions for it are really for something else such as advertising sites, etc.. Because without listings, a real estate website is just a real estate website.
Redfin has access to the MLS for the markets they are in so the argument in place by other services (cough, cough..) that it's closed is a false one. You just have to go through the process already in place to get to it which means getting licensed, etc.. (And real estate license laws vary by state and not controlled by the NAR.) Help U Sell, Assist to Sell, etc.. they have access to the MLS in Nevada and it's never been denied to them.
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The posters aren't concerned about seeing the listings, they want to see the realtor remarks sections.
Redfin has access to the MLS for the markets they are in so the argument in place by other services (cough, cough..) that it's closed is a false one. You just have to go through the process already in place to get to it which means getting licensed, etc.. (And real estate license laws vary by state and not controlled by the NAR.) Help U Sell, Assist to Sell, etc.. they have access to the MLS in Nevada and it's never been denied to them.
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The posters aren't concerned about seeing the listings, they want to see the realtor remarks sections.
Christine,
Here is someone who might disagree with your premise that it is always better to buy than rent...
http://www.trulia.com/voices/Home_Selling/How_do_you_sell_a_…
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Oh my let's everyone rent because we might have to move suddenly.
Here is someone who might disagree with your premise that it is always better to buy than rent...
http://www.trulia.com/voices/Home_Selling/How_do_you_sell_a_…
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Oh my let's everyone rent because we might have to move suddenly.
Nancy - Of course realtors want MLS closed - its the most significant advantage they have and adds the most value to using a realtor.
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LOL, you are truly deluding yourself if you think access to the information in the MLS is going to be any more helpful than what you already can find out. There's nothing there that isn't public information.
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LOL, you are truly deluding yourself if you think access to the information in the MLS is going to be any more helpful than what you already can find out. There's nothing there that isn't public information.
What I do want is to mine the housing data to help me answer the question of when I should buy a house. I want this data because I can't trust a RE agent to be honest about his/her market.
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I hand out the data all over the place. I give people print outs. What kind of data are you looking for? Ours is broken as far as number of sales, number of listings, UCs, by zip code and MLS area. However, some zip codes the numbers are so small they aren't meaningful. In a zip where one house sold for 2 million and the 3 others sold for 400,000, the average sale price is a little skewed. In my opinion you are overanalyzing.
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I hand out the data all over the place. I give people print outs. What kind of data are you looking for? Ours is broken as far as number of sales, number of listings, UCs, by zip code and MLS area. However, some zip codes the numbers are so small they aren't meaningful. In a zip where one house sold for 2 million and the 3 others sold for 400,000, the average sale price is a little skewed. In my opinion you are overanalyzing.
I'd love to be able to access our local MLS data in a meaningful way but currently its difficult and you need a license to even get access.
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The only thing you don't see on the public MLS that you see on our Realtor MLS is the private remarks such as the code for the lockbox or "don't let the black cat out", so in my area at least, I fail to see what is meaningful about the information you can't see.
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The only thing you don't see on the public MLS that you see on our Realtor MLS is the private remarks such as the code for the lockbox or "don't let the black cat out", so in my area at least, I fail to see what is meaningful about the information you can't see.
Excellent post, Chris.
(What is it with these "answer is too short" errors?!)
(What is it with these "answer is too short" errors?!)
I think that in areas where new construction didn't play a heavy role in the boom you might see a seller's market due to the conditions that you put forth.
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That would be my area. We don't have a lot of new construction. Certainly not that type. We've had a few condo developments where that is happening but not on as big a scale as elsewhere.
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That would be my area. We don't have a lot of new construction. Certainly not that type. We've had a few condo developments where that is happening but not on as big a scale as elsewhere.
By the way, Nicholas, what do you think of this? One scenario I have been kicking around in my head is that, after all the waves of foreclosures and short sales hit and pass, sellers who are upside down, don't have a lot of equity, or have homes they paid cash for or paid off their mortgage when they were worth more, who do not HAVE to move due to death, job transfer or divorce will simply hold tight and not list, causing a lack of inventory. This could actually cause a sellers market, since low inventory would favor sellers. But that's a bit in the future.
By the way, I agree with you JR about the lending industry tightening its standards the problem is 2003-2004 prices means we have another 30% or more to fall in Maryland. I don't believe that buyers are going to be rushing in to that if they are smart.
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I guess we'll have to see if they rush in and our areas are probably different. I see second home buyers jumping at some very good price reductions, and first home buyers picking up homes. An interesting thing I noticed yesterday in the Sunday Newsday, which is the Long Island paper, there is a list of Long Island home sales. There are about 1200 homes listed and the vast majority of them closed UNDER 500,000 with many many in the 200 and 300,000s. Only about 10% closed OVER 600,000. This is a quick count and estimate I did, I did not count every single one, I don't have THAT MUCH time on my hands, :) but did an average.
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I guess we'll have to see if they rush in and our areas are probably different. I see second home buyers jumping at some very good price reductions, and first home buyers picking up homes. An interesting thing I noticed yesterday in the Sunday Newsday, which is the Long Island paper, there is a list of Long Island home sales. There are about 1200 homes listed and the vast majority of them closed UNDER 500,000 with many many in the 200 and 300,000s. Only about 10% closed OVER 600,000. This is a quick count and estimate I did, I did not count every single one, I don't have THAT MUCH time on my hands, :) but did an average.
JR,
Why do you believe that prices will fall and what makes you believe that they will reach 2003-2004 levels? I don't live in your area and if you have insights into the reason your market is falling, it may give me insight into where my market is going.
I think we are more interested in the "why" then anything else.
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Because just prior to that is when banks handed out mortgages indiscriminatively and buyers went crazy and ran up the prices. I don't think they will fully fall back because buyers will rush in before they do. This is just an opinion based on what I see and human nature.
Why do you believe that prices will fall and what makes you believe that they will reach 2003-2004 levels? I don't live in your area and if you have insights into the reason your market is falling, it may give me insight into where my market is going.
I think we are more interested in the "why" then anything else.
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Because just prior to that is when banks handed out mortgages indiscriminatively and buyers went crazy and ran up the prices. I don't think they will fully fall back because buyers will rush in before they do. This is just an opinion based on what I see and human nature.
One reason that sales have increased is because of the spring market too.
Just after school lets out home owners become more mobile and begin to look at moving up. Just before school sessions start again in the fall there is another rise in activity because families don't want to move during the school year and that is thier last opportunity.
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So this is the mythical "spring bounce" most doomsayers make fun of
These are the things I hear on listing appointments to rationalize when to list. In reality there is activity all year long. There are less people looking over the holidays, but there is also less competition. I can't tell you how many times I've had people take their home off the market at Thanksgiving because "no one is looking over the holidays". Yet I've sold many listings over the holidays and gotten offers on Thanksgiving day and Christmas Eve.
Just after school lets out home owners become more mobile and begin to look at moving up. Just before school sessions start again in the fall there is another rise in activity because families don't want to move during the school year and that is thier last opportunity.
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So this is the mythical "spring bounce" most doomsayers make fun of
These are the things I hear on listing appointments to rationalize when to list. In reality there is activity all year long. There are less people looking over the holidays, but there is also less competition. I can't tell you how many times I've had people take their home off the market at Thanksgiving because "no one is looking over the holidays". Yet I've sold many listings over the holidays and gotten offers on Thanksgiving day and Christmas Eve.
I think, though I didn't give a TD, that its been pointed out many times that if you think prices are going to continue to fall, and nearly every sign points that way, its silly to say that you'll make the money back if you hold long enough.
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No more silly than some posters who believe they're practically going to be giving houses away. In reality none of us know how long it will take for prices to go up, or to go back up to pass what they are when you buy. I can remember buying my first home and watching prices go down around me, and thinking my goodness I'll never be able to sell this house for what I paid for it! $56,000!!
I most definitely believe prices will go down considerably where I am. They have already gone down 17% and I think they will pull back 2003-2004 levels before they go back up. However, I already see people scooping up home that were over 600,000 at 100,000 less, so how long and how far will it go? I have my opinion but that and a token will get me a ride on the subway.
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No more silly than some posters who believe they're practically going to be giving houses away. In reality none of us know how long it will take for prices to go up, or to go back up to pass what they are when you buy. I can remember buying my first home and watching prices go down around me, and thinking my goodness I'll never be able to sell this house for what I paid for it! $56,000!!
I most definitely believe prices will go down considerably where I am. They have already gone down 17% and I think they will pull back 2003-2004 levels before they go back up. However, I already see people scooping up home that were over 600,000 at 100,000 less, so how long and how far will it go? I have my opinion but that and a token will get me a ride on the subway.
Either your implying that RE agents have no responsibility to the markets they service or you implying that because no one else cares RE agents shouldn't have to care either.
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Nicholas, I don't know if you are asking me, but if you are, what is it that I said that implies RE have no responsibility to their market and because no one else care RE agents shouldn't have to care either?
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Nicholas, I don't know if you are asking me, but if you are, what is it that I said that implies RE have no responsibility to their market and because no one else care RE agents shouldn't have to care either?
I think your argument amounts to, "others are doing it, why cant we".
I won't point out the folly in that argument unless you need me to.
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OK, Nicholas. WWhhoooosh! Right over your head.
I won't point out the folly in that argument unless you need me to.
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OK, Nicholas. WWhhoooosh! Right over your head.
When you hire a lawyer, an economist, a financial planner, etc. you pay him for his time, not for his results.
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Not necessarily. Some financial planners charge 1% of a portfolio. Negligence attorneys charge a percentage of the award. They don't get paid if they lose the case.
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Not necessarily. Some financial planners charge 1% of a portfolio. Negligence attorneys charge a percentage of the award. They don't get paid if they lose the case.
The teachers I know have bachelor's degrees if they want to teach in accredited schools.
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I was pointing out how easy it is to get a higher credit in another field. Much like 3 day trips to the Bahamas where they partake in some kind of "conference" and gain credits toward a higher degree. You may not care and think it has nothing to do with anything, cut my taxes and yours go up?
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I was pointing out how easy it is to get a higher credit in another field. Much like 3 day trips to the Bahamas where they partake in some kind of "conference" and gain credits toward a higher degree. You may not care and think it has nothing to do with anything, cut my taxes and yours go up?
The requirements as I read them are as follows:
Be a great full-time salesman and take about 6 days of courses.
Be a good full-time salesman and take about 12 days of courses.
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Heck, I know teachers who get credits, which as you know result in pay increases, based on spending 2 and half days at a "storytelling" convention.
Be a great full-time salesman and take about 6 days of courses.
Be a good full-time salesman and take about 12 days of courses.
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Heck, I know teachers who get credits, which as you know result in pay increases, based on spending 2 and half days at a "storytelling" convention.
Chandler: I m not sure what you mean by "now THERE's a twist for you" . Details would help.
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Chandler, you took what another poster said: ""I do not know what my clients earn, what their credit score is, or what they do with their money. It is NONE OF MY BUSINESS. That is between them and their lender"
And replied thusly:
So you are saying as long as you can close your eyes and walk away with the commission , you are not going to take any ethical or moral responsibility towards the welfare of your buyer.
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That is a slanderous TWIST of what the original poster said. There are a lot of folks here who obviously hate realtors; you ARE supposed to give financial advice --- you're NOT supposed to give financial advice, we're damned if we do and damned if we don't. I know my job and I know what my job entails. I know my code of ethics. I understand the law of agency better than anyone in my office probably, and certainly better than any non realtor posting here. It's a total waste of the little free time I have to post here. I'm going to head out the door and earn my living and you can all go on wasting your time. I honestly don't care what you want to spin or what you believe. This is my profession.
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Chandler, you took what another poster said: ""I do not know what my clients earn, what their credit score is, or what they do with their money. It is NONE OF MY BUSINESS. That is between them and their lender"
And replied thusly:
So you are saying as long as you can close your eyes and walk away with the commission , you are not going to take any ethical or moral responsibility towards the welfare of your buyer.
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That is a slanderous TWIST of what the original poster said. There are a lot of folks here who obviously hate realtors; you ARE supposed to give financial advice --- you're NOT supposed to give financial advice, we're damned if we do and damned if we don't. I know my job and I know what my job entails. I know my code of ethics. I understand the law of agency better than anyone in my office probably, and certainly better than any non realtor posting here. It's a total waste of the little free time I have to post here. I'm going to head out the door and earn my living and you can all go on wasting your time. I honestly don't care what you want to spin or what you believe. This is my profession.
Chris
"I do not know what my clients earn, what their credit score is, or what they do with their money. It is NONE OF MY BUSINESS. That is between them and their lender"
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So you are saying as long as you can close your eyes and walk away with the commission , you are not going to take any ethical or moral responsibility towards the welfare of your buyer.
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Oh, now THERE"S a twist for you.
"I do not know what my clients earn, what their credit score is, or what they do with their money. It is NONE OF MY BUSINESS. That is between them and their lender"
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So you are saying as long as you can close your eyes and walk away with the commission , you are not going to take any ethical or moral responsibility towards the welfare of your buyer.
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Oh, now THERE"S a twist for you.
Hey Ryan, thanks for the BEST ANSWER. :)
A Chartered Financial Analyst is bound by ethical standards that specifically state that "Members and candidates must act for the benefit of their clients and place their clients' interest before their emplyoer's or their own interests." and that they must "have a reasonable and adequate basis, supported by appropriate research and investigation, for any investment analysis, recommendation or action."
It's unfortunate that Realtors often fall into a similar role, especially with first time homebuyers, but they are not bound to such ethical standards.
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Oh yes we are.
It's unfortunate that Realtors often fall into a similar role, especially with first time homebuyers, but they are not bound to such ethical standards.
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Oh yes we are.
Ben, is there no other avenue the family can follow other than defaulting on their debt?
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Like what? Take a second job to pay for the inflated house?
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God forbid, huh? God forbid you do what it takes to get out of what you got into. Simpler to just walk away, isn't it. The other poster is right, this country is going to go down the tubes because of people such as yourself.
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Like what? Take a second job to pay for the inflated house?
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God forbid, huh? God forbid you do what it takes to get out of what you got into. Simpler to just walk away, isn't it. The other poster is right, this country is going to go down the tubes because of people such as yourself.
Don't let these sobbing liberals fool you.
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I'm about as liberal as they come, and if the goverment bails out deadbeat borrowers I'll be really annoyed.
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I'm about as liberal as they come, and if the goverment bails out deadbeat borrowers I'll be really annoyed.
JR wrote: Oh really? Both parties agree that the borrower can walk away from the obligation if they think it's worth it to them? That's ridiculous.
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That's what the contracts say, so yes, that's what they agreed to.
It's not murder, it's not immoral. It's called being smart enough to understand the difference between breaking a contract (and accepting the pre-arranged penalty clauses) and actually committing sins like lying or murdering.
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Richard, what mortgage contract states that the borrower can walk away if they "feel" they can't afford to make payments? Is this what you're saying? In my opinion, defaulting on one's mortgage is no different from accepting student loans for medical school and then deciding not to pay them back because you decided you don't want to be a doctor you want be a painter. Once you start equivocating on how much money it would take to walk away from one's debts--a year's salary vs 6 years bad credit---you aren't far from equivocating how much it is worth to you to rob a bank. 10 years in jail vs a million? Killing your cheating wife: 20 years in jail vs the satisfaction. You're on a moral slippery slope and trying to justify your decisions. Sorry, it won't wash. Sin is sin. A crime is a crime.
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That's what the contracts say, so yes, that's what they agreed to.
It's not murder, it's not immoral. It's called being smart enough to understand the difference between breaking a contract (and accepting the pre-arranged penalty clauses) and actually committing sins like lying or murdering.
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Richard, what mortgage contract states that the borrower can walk away if they "feel" they can't afford to make payments? Is this what you're saying? In my opinion, defaulting on one's mortgage is no different from accepting student loans for medical school and then deciding not to pay them back because you decided you don't want to be a doctor you want be a painter. Once you start equivocating on how much money it would take to walk away from one's debts--a year's salary vs 6 years bad credit---you aren't far from equivocating how much it is worth to you to rob a bank. 10 years in jail vs a million? Killing your cheating wife: 20 years in jail vs the satisfaction. You're on a moral slippery slope and trying to justify your decisions. Sorry, it won't wash. Sin is sin. A crime is a crime.
J R
I don't believe people should walk away from their obligations. I think walking away is unethical. But I certainly can understand why some people may do it. For someone who brought at the peak and are down hundreds of thousands of dollars, their choice may be between providing for their family or paying for a grossly overpriced house that may never return to the level they brought at in their lifetime. What would you do? Would you sacrific your family?
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Ben, is there no other avenue the family can follow other than defaulting on their debt?
Your question brings to mind the famous "Han's problem". Han's wife needs medicine desperately. He cannot afford to buy the medicine. Is it morally OK for Hans to steal it from the pharmacy?
Today, Hans can probably get the drug directly from the pharmaceutical company and doesn't have to steal to take care of his family problem.
I don't believe people should walk away from their obligations. I think walking away is unethical. But I certainly can understand why some people may do it. For someone who brought at the peak and are down hundreds of thousands of dollars, their choice may be between providing for their family or paying for a grossly overpriced house that may never return to the level they brought at in their lifetime. What would you do? Would you sacrific your family?
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Ben, is there no other avenue the family can follow other than defaulting on their debt?
Your question brings to mind the famous "Han's problem". Han's wife needs medicine desperately. He cannot afford to buy the medicine. Is it morally OK for Hans to steal it from the pharmacy?
Today, Hans can probably get the drug directly from the pharmaceutical company and doesn't have to steal to take care of his family problem.
JR wrote: The flippant attitude in society today. It's truly disgusting to me that people sign a contract and think nothing about walking away from their moral obligations. How much would it take for you to murder someone,
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No no no no no.
It's not walking away from a moral obligation, it's breaking a two-sided financial contract, according to the agreed upon terms.
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Oh really? Both parties agree that the borrower can walk away from the obligation if they think it's worth it to them? That's ridiculous.
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No no no no no.
It's not walking away from a moral obligation, it's breaking a two-sided financial contract, according to the agreed upon terms.
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Oh really? Both parties agree that the borrower can walk away from the obligation if they think it's worth it to them? That's ridiculous.
JR, sometimes I feel like you are living in a different universe. I don't know how anyone can disagree with Richard's most recent post, which you described as "disgusting." He simply stated the obvious--that it's natural for individuals to act in their own financial interest. Offer: "no down payment for this gigantic house--if it appreciates (which it has done for years!), you reap ALL OF THE REWARDS (minus a 6% commission); if the housing bubble bursts, you bear none of the risk!" What's "disgusting" about accepting this offer??
Suppose I ask you to call heads or tails. If it's heads, you win $50,000. If it's tails, I shake your hand and you walk away with an "aw, shucks." What's "disgusting" about accepting my offer to play in this game? You'd be a moron not to play. Many people who "played" in the housing boom of the past decade stood to gain (and did gain) much more than $50,000. I doubt they think there was anything "disgusting" about their decision. And many people have faced foreclosure in the past few years as housing busted. Oh, well! Now they're in a new home or are renting, and the move/foreclosure was a pain, but with no money down, it's no skin off of their backs. For these people, the coin came up "tails," but there's nothing "disgusting" about it.
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As RealtyExec says in the next post, it is truly confusing, and to me terribly disgusting. The flippant attitude in society today. It's truly disgusting to me that people sign a contract and think nothing about walking away from their moral obligations. How much would it take for you to murder someone, Ryan? A million? Two? Does everything have a price. And a price as little as $50,000-100,000? What about cheating on your wife? Come on, no one will find out? And you're calling ME a MORON if I don't play this game? I lost equity in my first home in the 70s. A good $10,000. I was probably making $25,000 a year when I bought that house. I worked with a man who lost his home because he bought stocks with a margin account. He dragged himself back up by working hard. There are people with fortunes who lose them and make them again. You people really dissapoint me with your attitudes, you, Richard, Ben all of you who are so flippant about walking away from your debts. Our society has become very sick, is alI have to say about your attitude. And what you are doing is being as selfish as the reators you accuse of intentionally selling people houses they can't afford. Except what you are doing is screwing the country. Nice job. Keep it up. Just walk away from what you owe. Sick.
Suppose I ask you to call heads or tails. If it's heads, you win $50,000. If it's tails, I shake your hand and you walk away with an "aw, shucks." What's "disgusting" about accepting my offer to play in this game? You'd be a moron not to play. Many people who "played" in the housing boom of the past decade stood to gain (and did gain) much more than $50,000. I doubt they think there was anything "disgusting" about their decision. And many people have faced foreclosure in the past few years as housing busted. Oh, well! Now they're in a new home or are renting, and the move/foreclosure was a pain, but with no money down, it's no skin off of their backs. For these people, the coin came up "tails," but there's nothing "disgusting" about it.
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As RealtyExec says in the next post, it is truly confusing, and to me terribly disgusting. The flippant attitude in society today. It's truly disgusting to me that people sign a contract and think nothing about walking away from their moral obligations. How much would it take for you to murder someone, Ryan? A million? Two? Does everything have a price. And a price as little as $50,000-100,000? What about cheating on your wife? Come on, no one will find out? And you're calling ME a MORON if I don't play this game? I lost equity in my first home in the 70s. A good $10,000. I was probably making $25,000 a year when I bought that house. I worked with a man who lost his home because he bought stocks with a margin account. He dragged himself back up by working hard. There are people with fortunes who lose them and make them again. You people really dissapoint me with your attitudes, you, Richard, Ben all of you who are so flippant about walking away from your debts. Our society has become very sick, is alI have to say about your attitude. And what you are doing is being as selfish as the reators you accuse of intentionally selling people houses they can't afford. Except what you are doing is screwing the country. Nice job. Keep it up. Just walk away from what you owe. Sick.
So, as a Buyers Agent, you would have no idea what kind of financial shape your client is in? No clue whatsoever of your client's savings, income, or debt level? Don't know what kind of buying power the client really has?
True the client do not need to disclose his financial information. But you wouldn't think something may be wrong if a client, who does not look like he makes a lot of money, takes out an interest-only ARM and doing 100% financing? Maybe the client is getting in over his head and should be looking for a cheaper house? You should probably make sure the client really knows what he is doing, and not just execute the transaction and collect your commission. Right?
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You're kidding, right? You'd make one lousy salespeson if you judged how much moeny someone had by how they "look". People frequently spend more than they say they can on many types of puchases. Do you always tell sales people the truth? Or does everyone tell the truth except Realtors in your world?
True the client do not need to disclose his financial information. But you wouldn't think something may be wrong if a client, who does not look like he makes a lot of money, takes out an interest-only ARM and doing 100% financing? Maybe the client is getting in over his head and should be looking for a cheaper house? You should probably make sure the client really knows what he is doing, and not just execute the transaction and collect your commission. Right?
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You're kidding, right? You'd make one lousy salespeson if you judged how much moeny someone had by how they "look". People frequently spend more than they say they can on many types of puchases. Do you always tell sales people the truth? Or does everyone tell the truth except Realtors in your world?
What?: I was approved for $350,000 on my first house and chose only to buy a $200,000 because I knew that is what I was comfortable with.
So you know that one can be approved for way more money then the person can really affort. When you are acting as Buyers Agent, don't you think some of your clients may be making the mistake that you avoided?
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I am thinking of a neighbor who was approved for more than they spent. Their reason for not spending more was that they also wanted to do other thins such as go on nice vacations and be able to get new cars when they needed them. It's a budgeting what you have, not about given MORE than you can afford. They're teachers. They have a guaranteed income and pension, which around here can be over 100,000 a year each.
So you know that one can be approved for way more money then the person can really affort. When you are acting as Buyers Agent, don't you think some of your clients may be making the mistake that you avoided?
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I am thinking of a neighbor who was approved for more than they spent. Their reason for not spending more was that they also wanted to do other thins such as go on nice vacations and be able to get new cars when they needed them. It's a budgeting what you have, not about given MORE than you can afford. They're teachers. They have a guaranteed income and pension, which around here can be over 100,000 a year each.
Thirdly, even a well-meaning family who takes out a 95% LTV (with payments they can afford) is going to walk away if their home dips 30% in value.
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Are they? They have no morals do they? Very dismal view.
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Are they? They have no morals do they? Very dismal view.
it ignores the fact that a homeowner who took out a 100% LTV neg-am mortgage in a crazy market with the intention of defaulting if values went down, or selling if values went up is, in fact, acting very responsibly towards themselves. They're taking full advantage of the opportunities being offered.
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Totally disgusting.
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Totally disgusting.
This is true, although I wouldn't say "be able to get a job that enables them", because in many bubbled and high cost places, 80-90% of the jobs won't get you a home. I'm pretty laissez-faire personally, but I do think people have a legitimate complaint and have no problem with them laughing at others misery if they've been priced out of the market by bubbles fueled by NAR marketing and destructive gov't loan programs.
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I do have a problem with people laughing at other's misery. I have absolutely no sympathy for them, but I don't laugh at them. I believe the banks pushed loans on people. However, the banks explained what these loans entailed. I know, because I also own a home and had a home eq pushed on me with all the sales pitches about improvements I could do and vacations I could take and pay interest only for 10 years and then I could "just refinance"! Being that I have a brain and I am not greedy, I knew what would happen in 10 years if prices didn't keep going up. So you're right, it wasn't only people who had good jobs that could get these loans, anyone could. Naturally you would blame the NAR, you're probably one of the folks laughing at other's misery. IMO it was the banks' fault and the consumer themselves' fault.
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I do have a problem with people laughing at other's misery. I have absolutely no sympathy for them, but I don't laugh at them. I believe the banks pushed loans on people. However, the banks explained what these loans entailed. I know, because I also own a home and had a home eq pushed on me with all the sales pitches about improvements I could do and vacations I could take and pay interest only for 10 years and then I could "just refinance"! Being that I have a brain and I am not greedy, I knew what would happen in 10 years if prices didn't keep going up. So you're right, it wasn't only people who had good jobs that could get these loans, anyone could. Naturally you would blame the NAR, you're probably one of the folks laughing at other's misery. IMO it was the banks' fault and the consumer themselves' fault.
Answered by
Michael
Just Looking
in Houston
BEST ANSWER
maybe the people that rely on making commissions should see if their name is in this list, If you really want to know how good the advice they spew "really" is...take a look a the "hall of shame"..
Remember its a great time to buy!
http://realestaterecord.blogspot.com/
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The diffference between former slumps and this one is the internet. It just gives people who feel left out from homeownership and don't believe they'll ever be able to get a job that enables them to own their own home, an opportunity to broadcast their shadenfreud all over the world! :)
Michael
Just Looking
in Houston
BEST ANSWER
maybe the people that rely on making commissions should see if their name is in this list, If you really want to know how good the advice they spew "really" is...take a look a the "hall of shame"..
Remember its a great time to buy!
http://realestaterecord.blogspot.com/
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The diffference between former slumps and this one is the internet. It just gives people who feel left out from homeownership and don't believe they'll ever be able to get a job that enables them to own their own home, an opportunity to broadcast their shadenfreud all over the world! :)
Not one "Realtor pro" will dare mention the massive amount of resets hitting late summer and into 2009,
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I've mentioned them NUMEROUS times and I've also mentioned Wall Streeters who purchase second homes with 5% down expecting to keep their jobs.
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I've mentioned them NUMEROUS times and I've also mentioned Wall Streeters who purchase second homes with 5% down expecting to keep their jobs.
JR, have you been reading anything coming from Realtor B, a Naperville "Real Estate Pro"? Search the entire 729-post thread and I don't think you'll see any "profany"--or any profanity, for that matter--from those contributors who are down on real estate. A few posters have bashed the value of Realtors generally, but I can say pretty confidently that none on this side of the fence has wished cancer or AIDS on others' family members.
I really don't know what thread you're reading.
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I'm reading this thread. Many posts were removed by the moderators.
I really don't know what thread you're reading.
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I'm reading this thread. Many posts were removed by the moderators.
Also, it is a good time to build homes because you can get more home for your money if you control the process yourself and cut out all those middle men.
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I know a couple of very good builders who say now is a terrible time to build a home. They say the misconception is that housing prices are going down, therefore building costs are going down, but they aren't. I referred a couple of customers to builders, usually the builder is able to bring them to reality if I can't. It's cheaper to buy something in a neighborhood you like, that is priced well, and make it into the house you want over time, than to buy a lot and build a house on it.
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I know a couple of very good builders who say now is a terrible time to build a home. They say the misconception is that housing prices are going down, therefore building costs are going down, but they aren't. I referred a couple of customers to builders, usually the builder is able to bring them to reality if I can't. It's cheaper to buy something in a neighborhood you like, that is priced well, and make it into the house you want over time, than to buy a lot and build a house on it.
In any free market, all things being equal, as supply increases prices go down. As demand decreases, prices go down. Sound familiar to anything you see happening today? Take these two together, and prices go down a lot.
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Unless the supply is not really for sale. Judging from the number of realistic offers I present that are not countered, and the number of homeowners who are NOT "zombies" who want to try 150,000 over the number I suggest for a listing price, IMO the inventory is cluttered with these listings. In my area foreclosures are almost nonexistant, and there are a handful of short sales. I, too am anxiously awaiting the reajdustment of mortgages this August, however you are right, we have no idea when prices will stablize, just as we had no idea when prices would go down although we knew they would some day. That is why we can sell (and buy) homes, even now.
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Unless the supply is not really for sale. Judging from the number of realistic offers I present that are not countered, and the number of homeowners who are NOT "zombies" who want to try 150,000 over the number I suggest for a listing price, IMO the inventory is cluttered with these listings. In my area foreclosures are almost nonexistant, and there are a handful of short sales. I, too am anxiously awaiting the reajdustment of mortgages this August, however you are right, we have no idea when prices will stablize, just as we had no idea when prices would go down although we knew they would some day. That is why we can sell (and buy) homes, even now.
While I'll certainly agree that Mike is a bit blunt in his posts, its amazing how the most immature and inane continue to come from the 'pros' (not an indictment of all of you of course).
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Surely you jest. I haven't seen ANY pro use the profany I have seen coming from certain other posters.
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Surely you jest. I haven't seen ANY pro use the profany I have seen coming from certain other posters.
Ryan: I think you meant "ROTFL," meaning "Rolling on the floor laughing." Otherwise you're just "rolling on the floor," which makes you seem surprisingly insane (or a fire victim, in which case you should focusing on escape instead of this thread!).
Helping people with internet jargon since 1992,
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:0) Thanks Ryan. When I first started posting on the web, ROTF meant:
Acronym Definition
ROTF Rolling On The Floor (laughing)
http://acronyms.thefreedictionary.com/ROTF
Later updated to such acronyms ROTFLMAO and such. :)
Helping people with internet jargon since 1992,
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:0) Thanks Ryan. When I first started posting on the web, ROTF meant:
Acronym Definition
ROTF Rolling On The Floor (laughing)
http://acronyms.thefreedictionary.com/ROTF
Later updated to such acronyms ROTFLMAO and such. :)
Oh, and as for the implication that REALTORs shouldn't post here,
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ROTF. Without the realtors there would be no content.
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ROTF. Without the realtors there would be no content.
Good post, Joseph P! Ignore the thumbs down, there must be someone here with multiple screen names who enjoys giving them out. Which also explains the multiple thumbs up for the realtor bashers.
One of the most common REALTOR responses has been one about low interest rates, which has been handily criticized by a lot of posters for ignoring a lot of other issues.
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I bought my first home when interest rates were 16%. While people can come up with other reasons not to buy now, interest rates are not one of them.
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I bought my first home when interest rates were 16%. While people can come up with other reasons not to buy now, interest rates are not one of them.
hats funny...ask any realtor when it's a great time to buy
then ask em whens it a terrible time to buy.
You'll quickly find they all have commission breathe and could care less about your financial future...so go ahead and ask as many as you like...so far not a single realtor on this board has said anything other than it's a GTTB..not one
Real estate related businesses "Always" say GTTB, because they don't make money if buyers do not buy. These businesses and agents have a large financial interest in misleading the public about the foolishness of buying a house now.
Buyers' agents get nothing if there is no sale, so they want their clients to buy no matter how bad the deal is, the exact opposite of the buyer's best interest. Agents take $100 billion each year in commissions from buyers.
now of course you'll all ignore the tremendous loss of %6 trillion in home equity in the us..millions got totally screwed and you guys keep singing GTTB...amazing actually
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Mike, do you read any responses? Or do you just keep reposting the same thing. It's pointless for anyone to bother answering you.
then ask em whens it a terrible time to buy.
You'll quickly find they all have commission breathe and could care less about your financial future...so go ahead and ask as many as you like...so far not a single realtor on this board has said anything other than it's a GTTB..not one
Real estate related businesses "Always" say GTTB, because they don't make money if buyers do not buy. These businesses and agents have a large financial interest in misleading the public about the foolishness of buying a house now.
Buyers' agents get nothing if there is no sale, so they want their clients to buy no matter how bad the deal is, the exact opposite of the buyer's best interest. Agents take $100 billion each year in commissions from buyers.
now of course you'll all ignore the tremendous loss of %6 trillion in home equity in the us..millions got totally screwed and you guys keep singing GTTB...amazing actually
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Mike, do you read any responses? Or do you just keep reposting the same thing. It's pointless for anyone to bother answering you.
HOUSE LEGISLATION
The broad package approved by the House would retool the Federal Housing Administration program to guarantee up to $300 billion in home loans when a property has declined in value. Lenders would have to erase a portion of the original loan to secure a government guarantee on future payments by a homeowner. It would also give first-time home buyers a tax credit of up to $7,500, let states issue $10 billion in tax-exempt bonds to refinance loans and create a tougher regulator for Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.
The Congressional Budget Office estimated the bill could help as many as 500,000 homeowners and would cost the government an estimated $2.7 billion.
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I lost 40,000 in the stock market since January. Can they bail me out, too? Excuse me this is ridiculous.
The broad package approved by the House would retool the Federal Housing Administration program to guarantee up to $300 billion in home loans when a property has declined in value. Lenders would have to erase a portion of the original loan to secure a government guarantee on future payments by a homeowner. It would also give first-time home buyers a tax credit of up to $7,500, let states issue $10 billion in tax-exempt bonds to refinance loans and create a tougher regulator for Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.
The Congressional Budget Office estimated the bill could help as many as 500,000 homeowners and would cost the government an estimated $2.7 billion.
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I lost 40,000 in the stock market since January. Can they bail me out, too? Excuse me this is ridiculous.
"Jenny" a poster who has just created a profile and has made a grand total of ONE post writes:
I have just noticed something about this conversation. If you pull up the highest rated answers The top 20 or 30 are all biased against the Real Estate profession. Could this Ryan, JR, Mike , Richard all be the same person giving himself postives with seperate accounts? It just seems mighty suspicious to me. Someone may want to check the internet addresses of these posters.
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Maybe someone might want to check YOUR IP "jenny"
I have just noticed something about this conversation. If you pull up the highest rated answers The top 20 or 30 are all biased against the Real Estate profession. Could this Ryan, JR, Mike , Richard all be the same person giving himself postives with seperate accounts? It just seems mighty suspicious to me. Someone may want to check the internet addresses of these posters.
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Maybe someone might want to check YOUR IP "jenny"
JR: I'm sorry you feel we haven't removed enough. Our moderators and I have removed close to 100 posts, and I have already commented about our stance on moderating in moderation, so to speak (link below). Also I've seen a lot of attacks coming from real estate professionals, not just "members of the supposedly inquiring public". We'll keep watching this thread and remove the junk as we go.
Thanks for your participation.
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You're welcome, Roger, and although there are personal attacks on both sides, I've been reading this whole thread and can say the worst offenders are not the regular realtors who post here. I'm sure Trulia had the best of intentions in creating this website but it's obvious where it's heading.
Thanks for your participation.
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You're welcome, Roger, and although there are personal attacks on both sides, I've been reading this whole thread and can say the worst offenders are not the regular realtors who post here. I'm sure Trulia had the best of intentions in creating this website but it's obvious where it's heading.
that tax benefit you guys cling to, well its a ridiculous non benefit to owning real estate.
There are great tax advantages to owning.
FALSE. Everyone automatically gets a $9,500 tax deduction, just for breathing. You have to have interest expenses greater than $9,500 to get any advantage from the mortgage interest deduction. And even then, the tax advantage is not significant compared to the large monthly loss from owning.
Compare the cost of owning to renting.
Many people believe you can just reduce your income tax by the amount you pay in interest, but they are wrong.
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Blah, blah, blah, for someone who got into high dudgeon over realtors supposedly claiming they were financial experts, you sure blow a lot of your own financial spin and "advice", don't you?
There are great tax advantages to owning.
FALSE. Everyone automatically gets a $9,500 tax deduction, just for breathing. You have to have interest expenses greater than $9,500 to get any advantage from the mortgage interest deduction. And even then, the tax advantage is not significant compared to the large monthly loss from owning.
Compare the cost of owning to renting.
Many people believe you can just reduce your income tax by the amount you pay in interest, but they are wrong.
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Blah, blah, blah, for someone who got into high dudgeon over realtors supposedly claiming they were financial experts, you sure blow a lot of your own financial spin and "advice", don't you?
I find it pretty concerning that a member of Trulia would take time to go to my office website feel out a lead form that by the way that gets emailed to me anyways, and complain about me be being "while being incredibly abusive, argumentative and dishonest"
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I assume you mean one of the posters, and not Roger the moderator. I guess this is the latest form of contempt shown to realtors by internet trolls and bullies: putting in complaints about agents. I was a little disconcerted that Roger came on the scold rather than removing these offending posts, where members of the supposedly inquiring public have come here to insult us.
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I assume you mean one of the posters, and not Roger the moderator. I guess this is the latest form of contempt shown to realtors by internet trolls and bullies: putting in complaints about agents. I was a little disconcerted that Roger came on the scold rather than removing these offending posts, where members of the supposedly inquiring public have come here to insult us.
Mike:man the realtors keep talking about "investment"...hate to tell ya but you are no where near qualified to offer any "investment advice"....fancy yourselves investment planners?
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Actually, no I don't. You apparantly do, however. What qualifies you? I cut this from a 1000 word post full of investment advice. Too bad you don't have a license to loose nor can you be fined for giving bad advice.
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Actually, no I don't. You apparantly do, however. What qualifies you? I cut this from a 1000 word post full of investment advice. Too bad you don't have a license to loose nor can you be fined for giving bad advice.
The MLS data is manipulated in every way possible by agents everyday
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In what way is MLS data manipulated every day?
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In what way is MLS data manipulated every day?
now here's "real" investment advice that a $399 license holder would never dream of offering to you. remember when your realtor tells you a home is a great investment he''s really saying "i need a commission and i dont care what the hell happens to you in 5/10/15 years"
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I've got another great way for you to spend your time since you're so concerned about other people in 5/10/15 years: fight the tobacco companies. Elvis is right, you just like being an anonymous internet bully. Go back to Craigs List, there are plenty of others there like you, you can all have a happy little circle together.
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I've got another great way for you to spend your time since you're so concerned about other people in 5/10/15 years: fight the tobacco companies. Elvis is right, you just like being an anonymous internet bully. Go back to Craigs List, there are plenty of others there like you, you can all have a happy little circle together.
What's the point, Mike? Why waste your time telling people you don't like what they do for a living? If you really want to make a difference, surely there are other causes far more worthy of such a time investment, such as helping out at a soup kitchen or picketing a puppy mill. All you do in every post is lie and exaggerate and it gets worse with each post.
By all means Aj, keep renting....if you don't believe ANY time is worthwhile to buy, why do it?
Aj. . . . . . renter forever . . . .
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Aj. . . . . . renter forever . . . .
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BEST ANSWER
Amen Chris Freeman I couldn't agree with you more. The thing is as long as trulia gets web hits on this they will keep it up. There. is a boycott of this site in Chicago
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Unfortunately, as I suspected it would at the beginning, this has become another site to bash realtors, for whatever reason. i am amazed at the number of people who spend their time badmouthing this occupation.
Amen Chris Freeman I couldn't agree with you more. The thing is as long as trulia gets web hits on this they will keep it up. There. is a boycott of this site in Chicago
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Unfortunately, as I suspected it would at the beginning, this has become another site to bash realtors, for whatever reason. i am amazed at the number of people who spend their time badmouthing this occupation.
So lets first try to get you guys to be truthful, then we can work on civil.
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Judging from your subsequent posts, Mike, i guess you're still working on the civil part?
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Judging from your subsequent posts, Mike, i guess you're still working on the civil part?
Facts always confuse the ramen eaters
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Craig's List is ----------------------> that way
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Craig's List is ----------------------> that way
Richard:
JR: I'm just drawing from the responses found on this board. I admit that it's possible that the sample size is not enormous, but it does appear to be skewed very significantly towards the 'buy now' crowd.
Secondly, I'm not angry with anybody. I'm proposing a business plan that would, in fact, be fabulously profitable if the market is at or near recovery. If you guys are able to prove this is the case, even in limited markets, somebody should be able to create the product and make (literally) millions of dollars off of my idea. It's silly to accuse me of being angry when I'm proposing an incredibly valuable business plan and am explicitly not claiming rights to it, nor am I requesting commission.
JR: I am just drawing on the responses from many non real estate employed, when I say you appear angry. If you have a business model, by all means do it. Sell your insurance. I would worry, if such insurance were available, about people making unwise buying decisions because they are insured, but if you think you can make money doing it, go right ahead. That is not what this thread is about, however.
JR: I'm just drawing from the responses found on this board. I admit that it's possible that the sample size is not enormous, but it does appear to be skewed very significantly towards the 'buy now' crowd.
Secondly, I'm not angry with anybody. I'm proposing a business plan that would, in fact, be fabulously profitable if the market is at or near recovery. If you guys are able to prove this is the case, even in limited markets, somebody should be able to create the product and make (literally) millions of dollars off of my idea. It's silly to accuse me of being angry when I'm proposing an incredibly valuable business plan and am explicitly not claiming rights to it, nor am I requesting commission.
JR: I am just drawing on the responses from many non real estate employed, when I say you appear angry. If you have a business model, by all means do it. Sell your insurance. I would worry, if such insurance were available, about people making unwise buying decisions because they are insured, but if you think you can make money doing it, go right ahead. That is not what this thread is about, however.
The NAR is filled with hundreds of thousands of REALTORs nearly all of whom claim that now is a good time to buy.
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Have you polled every one of them, then, Richard? How long did that take you? Do you have the numbers? Making statements such as this is just inflammatory and shows an agenda. Why are you so angry at people you don't know?
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Have you polled every one of them, then, Richard? How long did that take you? Do you have the numbers? Making statements such as this is just inflammatory and shows an agenda. Why are you so angry at people you don't know?
If your house declines for 2 years, then climbs from 28, it is a declining asset and you'd be far better off buying it in 2 years than now. The logic of this has been rehashed many many times below.
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The unfortunate fact is you have no idea when to buy. Maybe you should wait 3 years. Or 4. Maybe 10. Maybe never buy. That is the problem with timing markets, people tend to stay on the sidelines, it's a fact. I've done it myself.
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The unfortunate fact is you have no idea when to buy. Maybe you should wait 3 years. Or 4. Maybe 10. Maybe never buy. That is the problem with timing markets, people tend to stay on the sidelines, it's a fact. I've done it myself.
Aj what makes you an expert on Chicago you live in that cesspool NYC.
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Save your comments for Aj, don't drag us New Yorkers, who LOVE NY, into it.
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Save your comments for Aj, don't drag us New Yorkers, who LOVE NY, into it.
Chandler: However, moving forward is it still reasonable to have the same mentality of flipping houses for profit?
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JR; I can't foresee that answer. As I can't foresee where the bottom is, how low it will go and how long it will last (which other posters ask). All I can say is, we'll see....if the market goes as low as some folks here wish it would, if foreclosures go for pennies on the dollar....we'll see if there is any flipping, and we'll also see who is doing it. I predict it will be the very same "housing exceeds salaries!!!" whiners that are decring high prices now who will be the ones doing the flipping---and as you say in the beginning of your post, "Lets face it. Everyone wants to make money and circumstances were created which made it easier for a section of people to make lot of money. " We may be seeing circumstances created again....and the cycle goes on.
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JR; I can't foresee that answer. As I can't foresee where the bottom is, how low it will go and how long it will last (which other posters ask). All I can say is, we'll see....if the market goes as low as some folks here wish it would, if foreclosures go for pennies on the dollar....we'll see if there is any flipping, and we'll also see who is doing it. I predict it will be the very same "housing exceeds salaries!!!" whiners that are decring high prices now who will be the ones doing the flipping---and as you say in the beginning of your post, "Lets face it. Everyone wants to make money and circumstances were created which made it easier for a section of people to make lot of money. " We may be seeing circumstances created again....and the cycle goes on.
The problem I see with not researching is that you will continue to pay astronomical asking prices.
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Good question Chandler, but I was asking the same thing when a cottage sold for over 200,000 when the one next door had sold for 80,000 6 months earlier. I thought, Didn't they check to see what other house were selling for? Those same buyers probably sold their 200,000 cottage for 6 or 8 hundred thousand 6 years later to another buyer. Now where do we place the blame for inflated prices? Hmmmmmmm.....?
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Good question Chandler, but I was asking the same thing when a cottage sold for over 200,000 when the one next door had sold for 80,000 6 months earlier. I thought, Didn't they check to see what other house were selling for? Those same buyers probably sold their 200,000 cottage for 6 or 8 hundred thousand 6 years later to another buyer. Now where do we place the blame for inflated prices? Hmmmmmmm.....?
Seems like a good way to possibly lose a house if you own one.
Zack:
The candid part IMO was the the Look Ahead section including quotes:
"There are no expectations for rates to increase in the coming months."
"While Westchester and Putnam may be fortunate to have avoided the worst effects of the national real estate market recession up to now, there are serious threats ahead."
I also agree with the doc's hope that the recession will treat the area with kid gloves. All in all, I think this is the type of information people like me are looking for and was glad to read it.
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Oh yes, serious threats. Such as the 3 year ARMS taken at the height of sales (2005) that will readjust in August. I also hope recession does not get a lot worse but gas was 4.00 yesterday and today raised to 4.09. Hope it doesn't increase to 5.00 by the end of the year. Bush is an oil guy. The price of oil has tripled. One comic said the other day that if Col Sanders was elected president and the price of chicken tripled it would be mighty suspicious.... :)
The candid part IMO was the the Look Ahead section including quotes:
"There are no expectations for rates to increase in the coming months."
"While Westchester and Putnam may be fortunate to have avoided the worst effects of the national real estate market recession up to now, there are serious threats ahead."
I also agree with the doc's hope that the recession will treat the area with kid gloves. All in all, I think this is the type of information people like me are looking for and was glad to read it.
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Oh yes, serious threats. Such as the 3 year ARMS taken at the height of sales (2005) that will readjust in August. I also hope recession does not get a lot worse but gas was 4.00 yesterday and today raised to 4.09. Hope it doesn't increase to 5.00 by the end of the year. Bush is an oil guy. The price of oil has tripled. One comic said the other day that if Col Sanders was elected president and the price of chicken tripled it would be mighty suspicious.... :)
In my neck of the woods, the MLS posted their 1Q report and its not rosy. This is amazingly candid for a real estate document.
http://www.wcbr.net/Library/stats/stats08/SR1st08_Report_Fin…
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I don't think that report was any more candid than any other I've seen. Facts are facts. It's too bad we have no idea how much of that abundance of inventory is not really for sale. We all know new construction is for sale, of course. But in an area such as mine--and perhaps Westchester, not sure how much building has gone on there--we don't have much new construction. Our inventory is existing home sales, and judging from my own experience and other agents I have spoken to recently (since it has happened to me), many of those homes don't seem to be available, as offers are not being countered and homes are being withdrawn when offers do come.
http://www.wcbr.net/Library/stats/stats08/SR1st08_Report_Fin…
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I don't think that report was any more candid than any other I've seen. Facts are facts. It's too bad we have no idea how much of that abundance of inventory is not really for sale. We all know new construction is for sale, of course. But in an area such as mine--and perhaps Westchester, not sure how much building has gone on there--we don't have much new construction. Our inventory is existing home sales, and judging from my own experience and other agents I have spoken to recently (since it has happened to me), many of those homes don't seem to be available, as offers are not being countered and homes are being withdrawn when offers do come.
JR
I have to disagree with you with respect to the bottom of the market
People couldn't recognize peak because it was difficult for them for see the impending drastic fall. I mean if the financial companies couldn't foresee the impending (or may be they did who knows) , then you can hardly expect people to recognize the peak. However, people who weren't greedy took in some healthy profits in 2005-2006.
In my opinion its easier to time the bottom in this market. The reason being the prices are not going to rise at the rate they have fallen. Once the market becomes stagnant prices will lurk within +/- 1-3% of past quarters. So while you still won't be able to get the exact bottom you will be pretty close to it. In fact, it will be a long time before anyone sees any uptick in the prices.
So recognizing bottom will be far easier (relatively - only people who do some research will be in a good position) than recognizing the peak
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I share your view that the market will be stagnant when it reaches the bottom, before it rises again. Thisis what I try to explain to sellers who are going to "wait". They will be waiting a long time.
You are correct, sellers who weren't greedy made a healthy profit, but so did sellers who were greedy!! I have one seller who got into a contract at the end of 2006 and closed in Feb 2007 who STILL think they gave their house away! They did better than they would do now, I know that for a fact.
I have to disagree with you with respect to the bottom of the market
People couldn't recognize peak because it was difficult for them for see the impending drastic fall. I mean if the financial companies couldn't foresee the impending (or may be they did who knows) , then you can hardly expect people to recognize the peak. However, people who weren't greedy took in some healthy profits in 2005-2006.
In my opinion its easier to time the bottom in this market. The reason being the prices are not going to rise at the rate they have fallen. Once the market becomes stagnant prices will lurk within +/- 1-3% of past quarters. So while you still won't be able to get the exact bottom you will be pretty close to it. In fact, it will be a long time before anyone sees any uptick in the prices.
So recognizing bottom will be far easier (relatively - only people who do some research will be in a good position) than recognizing the peak
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I share your view that the market will be stagnant when it reaches the bottom, before it rises again. Thisis what I try to explain to sellers who are going to "wait". They will be waiting a long time.
You are correct, sellers who weren't greedy made a healthy profit, but so did sellers who were greedy!! I have one seller who got into a contract at the end of 2006 and closed in Feb 2007 who STILL think they gave their house away! They did better than they would do now, I know that for a fact.
A lot of folks I talk to say it's impossible to time the bottom of the market, and in the same breath claim prices are rising and the market is coming back. I interpret that as saying "the bottom of the market is ending". It's not as if house prices rise 15% in a week, so as long as you keep an eye on the market and buy around the time you start seeing some action and an uptick in prices over and above normal seasonality effects, then for all intents and purposes you've timed the bottom of the market.
Or am I missing something?
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Roger, I think the best way to answer the question "how will we know when the market has hit it's bottom" is, how did you know it had hit it's peak? There are still sellers who think they can ask much more than they paid in 2005. I know of someone who paid 650,000 in 2005 who is asking 725,000 now. And other paid 999,999 in 2005 and is asking 1.5M. Similarly, when the market swings, there will be lowballers. We won't know until months after the fact and even then, some will be in denial that it has happened.
Or am I missing something?
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Roger, I think the best way to answer the question "how will we know when the market has hit it's bottom" is, how did you know it had hit it's peak? There are still sellers who think they can ask much more than they paid in 2005. I know of someone who paid 650,000 in 2005 who is asking 725,000 now. And other paid 999,999 in 2005 and is asking 1.5M. Similarly, when the market swings, there will be lowballers. We won't know until months after the fact and even then, some will be in denial that it has happened.
Tom
Wow I feel honored someone gave me a negative for an apology.
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I've gotten negatives for saying thanks for the information. That's one of the reasons I think they should get rid of the whole thumbs up thumbs down!
Wow I feel honored someone gave me a negative for an apology.
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I've gotten negatives for saying thanks for the information. That's one of the reasons I think they should get rid of the whole thumbs up thumbs down!
However, if the comps show the house should be priced at 999,000 and it's listed at 949,000, it IS priced below market value. ;)
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Or, it is possible that the comps are off. It is not uncommon to have two different realtors put together different comps.
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As if neither realtor is aware of the other's research when the offer is submitted. "HERE'S a house that sold for 899,000!!" "Yes, but it didn't have 5 bedrooms, a pool, and a brand new kitchen."
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Or, it is possible that the comps are off. It is not uncommon to have two different realtors put together different comps.
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As if neither realtor is aware of the other's research when the offer is submitted. "HERE'S a house that sold for 899,000!!" "Yes, but it didn't have 5 bedrooms, a pool, and a brand new kitchen."
Zack:
Ryan,
I HATE the "below market value" thing also. I actually think it should be considered unethical but whatever. I started a thread about it actually: http://www.trulia.com/voices/Market_Conditions/Odd_possibly_… In an amusing twist, when I posted this, it was "BELOW MARKET VALUE!" at $999,000, so since its now at $949,000, it must be super double BELOW MARKET VALUE.
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I'm not too crazy about the term below market value, either, because if someone pays that amount , the number BECOMES market value. However, if the comps show the house should be priced at 999,000 and it's listed at 949,000, it IS priced below market value. ;)
Ryan,
I HATE the "below market value" thing also. I actually think it should be considered unethical but whatever. I started a thread about it actually: http://www.trulia.com/voices/Market_Conditions/Odd_possibly_… In an amusing twist, when I posted this, it was "BELOW MARKET VALUE!" at $999,000, so since its now at $949,000, it must be super double BELOW MARKET VALUE.
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I'm not too crazy about the term below market value, either, because if someone pays that amount , the number BECOMES market value. However, if the comps show the house should be priced at 999,000 and it's listed at 949,000, it IS priced below market value. ;)
Jerry Murphy's answer is unintentionally hilarious. While Zack is correct that sometimes houses go down, I want to talk about Jerry's anecdote a bit more.
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And another country heard from, LOL!
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And another country heard from, LOL!
I also can't help but comment on Jerry's opinions. First, let's talk about his friend's parents who've seen their house go from 32K to $1M. Well, over 48 years that's earned them 7.5% - not a bad return at all. From 1950 to 2007 the S&P 500 returned 9.2% annually. If only they'd rented instead!!!!
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I find it amazing that so many folks who are NOT working in real estate every day know so much more than those of us who do. Well actually, I don't find it amazing. I see it just about every time I do a listing presentation and show a homeowner 10 identical homes to theirs that just sold for 450,000-475,000 and ask "now where do you think we should price YOUR home" and they look at me with a blank stare and deadpan: "625,000?"
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I find it amazing that so many folks who are NOT working in real estate every day know so much more than those of us who do. Well actually, I don't find it amazing. I see it just about every time I do a listing presentation and show a homeowner 10 identical homes to theirs that just sold for 450,000-475,000 and ask "now where do you think we should price YOUR home" and they look at me with a blank stare and deadpan: "625,000?"
Zack: You said, "Try telling that to my friend's parents in Los Gatos, CA who bought their home in 1960 for $32,000 which is now worth about $1 mil. Inflation or not, that's a good return on your investment."
This is high comedy. You claim I analyze things the way the media does, then you cite a single home as an example of how housing is a great investment. So by your methods, I'll use my parents. My parents house cost them $150k 21 years ago in upstate NY, today they could sell it for about $130k. Over 21 years, losing 20k on your house must mean housing is a horrible investment.
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Location, location, location. Upstate has always been depressed.
This is high comedy. You claim I analyze things the way the media does, then you cite a single home as an example of how housing is a great investment. So by your methods, I'll use my parents. My parents house cost them $150k 21 years ago in upstate NY, today they could sell it for about $130k. Over 21 years, losing 20k on your house must mean housing is a horrible investment.
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Location, location, location. Upstate has always been depressed.
J R answered:
Sylvia where I am listing brokers sometimes put 0% or 1% for buyer's agent. What would you do in that case?
Again I come back to the topic of ignorance. Most listing agents who feel this way are parroting their brokers, who don't understand buyer agency. All you can do is educate the listing agent. Or try to.
J R answered:
There are a few reasons why I have never shown a FSBO.
I've never been inside the house.
I don't know what, if anything, the seller is willing to pay.
I don't know the price.
If I know the price, it's usually too high.
And.......because of the reception I usually get when I speak to a FSBO.
I've never been inside the house.
I don't know what, if anything, the seller is willing to pay.
I don't know the price.
If I know the price, it's usually too high.
And.......because of the reception I usually get when I speak to a FSBO.
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