This is open solicitation on your part of a client that is currently under a representation contract with another agent. This violates our REALTOR Code of Ethics. I would recommend you remove your response and review the Code prior to making further postings.
I, too (like Deborah) was pretty much thrown in to the deep end when I got my license in 1994. I was TERRIFIED for most of the first year until I made it my business to read and ask a lot of questions. I worked as an assistant to a high volume agent for 5 years which taught me much about what TO do and what NOT to do.
I think the idea about all agents having to perform an apprenticeship of sorts is an excellent one! That would really separate those serious agents from those who believe that real estate can be a hobby where you can earn some money.
I have also been on the receiving end of the phone call asking for help or guidance from an agent with another company. What I find more troubling is having agents who want to tell me how the transaction is going to go when I know that process is in direct conflict with procedural changes that occurred years ago. I was told recently by an agent, "Well, I know it's changed, but that's the way I've always done it.". Sheesh!
As for Erik, I agree that your financial needs are not what determines the fair market price for your home. I know that is tough to hear. And, if in fact, you're in an area where not many buyers are looking, it can take longer than normal market time. We currently have something like approx. 10 months worth of inventory on the market.
Good luck with your decision making.
Your statement that a degree (or I would accept some type of equivalent thereof) should be a requirement to get a real estate license would get a lot of industry support. I would propose (don't know who I am proposing to ....but.....)
…………. that new agents be co-agents on at least 2-3 buyer transactions before they can represent a buyer on their own. And, that a new agent be a co-lister on at least 5 transactions before they can solely represent a seller. I would propose that new agents be given a provisional license, and it be identified as such. Upon completion of transactions, experience and further education, a full license could be issued.
We have several designations that do not mean much, and that detracts from the designations that do have value. :-(
I believe the fundamentals of what makes up our day to day business should be taught in a formalized setting and completion of this type of education should be required for a license. I don't know about all of you, but I learned the definitions of alluvion and avulsion in real estate school over and over and am still waiting to use that information. I went to real estate school 3x. Salesperson - NJ; Broker-FL and Broker-NJ (NJ does not have reciprocity), and at no time did I learn any practical application knowledge in real estate. Well, I learned how to hand compute a HUD in FL school, and that was a good thing. I think a lot of agents, particularly in NJ, don’t know how to read a HUD because we rely so much on the attorneys. In NJ salesperson school, I was annoyed at the lack of basic math skills, and questions from students that surprised me. I intentionally missed the maximum hours possible, read the book and passed the test. (I always was very good at cramming and memorizing; math comes easy to me; and I am really lousy typist/keyboarder.)
My first employing broker had a training program in which only half of the instructors showed up. The instructors who showed up were visiting managers, who had sometimes seen the module material for the first time during the classroom hour. So, I went on the street, armed with a real estate license and corporate background of sales and marketing. My mentor and I never had one meeting, and after 2 weeks of no return calls, I started to pave a path of self-teaching. Fast forward a dozen years or so, and I consider myself knowledgeable and competent.
Today, I had a buyer agent, from another brokerage, calling me to ask me what to do next, because she didn’t know. She was apologizing for calling me, but thought I would help her. I did. I did not, and will not, get involved w/ her transaction, but I coached her that it was OK to follow up, make phone calls, and look out for her buyer. Little does her buyer know that she is unsure, and being coached by a broker from another company. Go figure!
There are many excellent Realtors out there. I learn from my peers every day. There are also a good number who could best serve the industry by finding another job.
Deborah
I thought we did cover the "shortage of buyers" but not as directly as you did.
I wrote:
I wouldn't cut prices over and over again if a market, as a whole, was having minimal showings. If that be the case, we have to work through enough time for buyer to surface.
and
In a market where there are few buyers, or no buyers, who are we going to motivate to gravitate from fence sitter to active buyer?
Chris...thank you for your clarity. Yes, Elvis and I were both trying to say that when there is a shortage of buyers, you may have to just wait out the time period necessary to bring forth a buyer. Only local RE Pros can tell Erik if, for him, it's a price issue, or a lack of buyer issue. Chris, you said it directly and clearly; thanks
Deborah
In the few years that I have been in the business I have met alot of people that should not be agents of any kind. The ones that got in when it was hopping are now finding themselves not knowing what to do because they are use to doing Nothing and getting Paid. In real estate you have to be Creative, Know the Internet (and not be afraid it) and find the sites that people are looking at to start their house hunt. I'm sure we all know that the internet is where the majority of people start looking. There are a lot of places to advertise that are free. It does require time to list the listings. I work with some people who really are waiting for things to go back to the way they were, instead of trying to find new ways. Eric, you are absolutely right in saying that if something changes, you have to change with it. You get left behind if you don't! I think the last straw for me would have been the blown off meeting. Good Luck! Kimmie
I agree, there are many agents out there who are below the curve, and behind the 8-ball. I'm not one of them. In fact, I'm way over-qualified to be a real estate agent, but I don't want the "headaches" that come with management. I've been there, done that, and I enjoy being one of the crowd, and setting my own hours, and taking on the clients I choose.
There are many agents who got in on the boom, and now the boom is sweeping them away (sailboat boom, not "misspelled" broom). I welcome the "shake out" of those peripheral agents who weren't doing much business, and were doing a tremendous disservice to their clients and the industry.
I am also a proponent of higher entry standards to the business, as is Deborah. In fact I've said so since day one... when I took the Illinois state test and asked "who designed this test?" Most of the questions asked have very little to do with what we do day in and day out (ie: who needs to memorize how many square feet in an acre?? That's what google is for, or a call to my managing broker).
To address your pricing concern: Yes, many sellers have not come to terms with today's market and refuse to price realistically, or in the face of a changing market, refuse to react in a timely fashion. But I think, when you think it through, you have to agree that reducing the price is not always the answer.
My comment about the Bachelor's degree is a derivative of the experience that I have in my area.
I know of many agents who got into real estate during the boom and they barely know anything other than the latest soundbite from their peers.
As far as pricing goes. I firmly believe that many sellers refuse to understand that the macro-economic fundementals point to further declines in most indexes; real estate especially.
I like realism in my paradigms.
I well meet and exceed you entry requirements. I vote w/ Elvis on the concept that it depends upon the marekt. I posted concurrently when you did, and my post dealt with a discussion with Elvis about underpricing as a marketing strategy.
I wouldn't cut prices over and over again if a market, as a whole, was having minimal showings. If that be the case, we have to work through enough time for buyer to surface.
Too many sellers overprice. Overpricing hurts the end result, and net sale. It is important to price right. Part of pricing right is a consideration and evaluation of the activity and volume of potential buyers in the given market. Since that is true, and we don't know Erik's market, it becomes difficult to say, under absolute terms that the problem is price alone.
Price, marketing, activity, market conditions, a review of past marketing and responses are all factors to be considered. Maybe Erik should reduce his price.....but it's possible that might not be the answer.
~~~~~~~~~~~
Sorry... there is nothing inherently wrong with my statement.
Yes, if the property is overvalued, then it's not going to sell, regardless of the monkey suit. But that's NOT always the case. Would you agree, that there's just so much inventory, that sometimes it just takes a while to work through it all?
We're currently in a market, in my area, where it takes 180 days on average to sell. That doesn't mean that after 30-60 days, if you lower your price, you'll snag a buyer.
A sign in the yard, and a single unadvertised open house, doesn't even qualify as "marketing" let along "Creative Marketing".
Some Realtors don't have much in their arsenal of marketing tools and the first thing they go to is the "price reduction". That's not always the answer.
And I hold more than your "entry level requirement".
I'm an agent with a company that exclusively represents buyers. My take is that if you've had a good number of showings, especially in the first 30 days and your house is tidy and in good condition, perhaps what you are viewing as an aggressive price might not be in keeping with what the up to date market information is telling us. It might be a good idea to have another market evaluation done to determine if your price is, in fact, competitive.
Sometimes sellers (and I'm not saying this is you) think that their house is competitively priced, but also believe it's priced higher because their house is so much better than all of the other houses out there. It might be worth your time to go out for an hour or 2 and view some of the other homes in your area that are similar house types and similar price range to make sure your house has the "goods" to get the price you think it's worth. In today's market, it really is about pricing!! If buyers are seeing other homes in your area and buying those and not yours, it's because they view the other homes as a better deal, they're getting more for what they're spending.
There is also a strategy on the part of some lisitng agents to price a house just below what the market indicates in order to attract traffic. Sellers think this is a bad idea, but I've been involved in several transactions where this strategy has attracted multiple offers and yielded a higher price than they might have received with a higher initial list price. Good luck~
The best thing to do is ask for a meeting with the agent and his broker. Go into the meeting with an open mind and letting them know your concerns, dissapointments, and future expectations. Listen to what they have to say also. They might be surprised about your dissapointment. After the meeting, should you still feel uneasy about the agent that represents you, then maybe a change is in order.
One thing that might happen is the broker offer to replace the agent with another one from his/her office that might better fit your needs. This way the broker does not lose the listing, but solves a way to keep his client (you) happy. This is usually the easiest route to go, instead of searching for another agent, but if you do find you would rather go that route, then ask for referrals from friends, co-workers, etc. Good luck!
The time to fire your realtor is when you have either lost faith in their ability to sell your house, or don't trust them to tell you the truth. I would take your specific concerns to the agent and give them a shot to address them and make things right by you. If you don't feel satisfied with what he/she proposes, you have the right to ask for a termination and they have the right to say yes or no (most won't hold you up).
I hope that helps.
Cameron Piper
Here are some tactics I have been using to ramp it up on the marketing side here in Redmond WA:
1. Have your agent coordinate the open houses with all the local listings. Having the whole neighborhood "open" at the same time usually brings a more diverse crowd, etc. and allows the agents to coordinate their marketing efforts to get more bang for their bucks.
2. Ask your agent for a link (preferable tied to a nice photo of your home) to add to every email you send out and add a line under the link "Please forward this link of my awesome home for sale to anyone you know that may be thinking about buying!" The more exposure the better - especailly to people who know you and want to help. Plus this gives the agent more exposure - a win - win and it's FREE.
3. Consider the print advertising in the small local papers with a nice photo.
4. post a special feature or incentive on the yard sign (and add that to the link info, too)
5. Your photos must be outstanding. over 80% (last time I checked with NAR (National Association of Realtors) of home buyers shop the internet first. The idea is to get them interested in that breif moment that they see your photo. So only use the impressive shots.
6. Have faith in the market, it may be slow, but its moving forward. Your home will sell.
Good luck with your realtor review, they should appreciate your concerns and work double time to create some new tactics, or use some of mine, to get the darned house sold.
Wishing you a happy, healthy baby!
Jennifer
You highlight one of the major problems with increasing standards. There are always good agents who will not otherwise qualify. There would certainly need to be some grandfathering of the current agents. However, as long as these problems keep us at bay, nothing will ever change. I am not saying that a degree is it, but something needs to be done otherwise we will continue to face the same problems that we have been for the last few years.
Cameron Piper
If a bachelor's degree had been a requirement, I would not be in this business, and neither would many other great agents.
The MNAR Government Affairs Committee put together a survey two years ago asking the membership a number of questions, I will try to find the results online and post back. Essentially we asked whether realtors thought that we needed more stringent qualifications. We received a resounding yes to that question, but we then proposed 10-15 possible solutions and as a whole the membership thought each one was a bad idea. Everything from retesting every couple of years to education requirements.
Everybody thinks that we should have higher standards, but nobody is willing to do the hard work of changing the current scenario.
Cameron Piper
Thanks for your redent posts~!
Erik,
I don't know if your price is right or not. But, if the market says its too high, then you will have to decide to lower it, or face the possibiity of just staying put. Unfortunately, the market does not accomodate our financing needs, but rather, we must meet it's terms or withdraw. Maybe you are not too high, and you need to hang in there at the current price. Pull out the "objective" set of eyeglasses, step back and evaluate datat w/ your Realtor. Best of luck.
Deborah
I believe that Aaron's comments were specically tailored to the post made by Tim very early in the thread, and Cameron's discussion about Realtors COE and SOP prohibiting, or not, the solicitation of an existing listing. I don't believe Aaron's comments challenged any other poster's comments on this thread.
On the note of underpricing......It works IF you have real buyers in your marketplace. It works as an ignitor for fence sitters, when there are an abundance of them....or in an active buyers market. If there is simply a lack of buyers, then lowering the price under market will not create competition, but allow the one buyer who strikes an interest an oppty to get a good deal. As seller agents, our job is to get the best deal for the seller.
In the market I work, we have buyers who want to buy, and tread water waiting for a sign that it is a good oppty and OK to take the plunge. When we go to market with a good price, we can generate 3-6 offers quickly...if also given broad market exposure.
I do not recommend under pricing without a strong marketing campaign. The goal is to quickly reach all the buyers, and that requires a well planned and executed promotional campaign.
In a market where there are few buyers, or no buyers, who are we going to motivate to gravitate from fence sitter to active buyer?
So, without knowing what you meant by your reply.....I will, in theory, agree that one has to choose carefully when and how to execute this strategy. Since I am not in Erik's market, I cannot render an opinion about employing this method for his property.
Deborah
There is no interpretation of SOP 16-4 in the 2008 Code of Ethics and Arbitration manual.
http://rodomino.realtor.org/2008CEAM.nsf/1ea4bd9041b3346c862
As such it would be open to interpretation by the arbitration panel convened. I still maintain that SOP 16-2 states in pretty plain language the intention of Article 16. One thing to remember when reading the code is that the Standards of Practice are not seperate rules in and of themselves they are clarifications of the original rule.
In this case you are citing the original rule of Article 16 which says:
"REALTORS® shall not engage in any practice or take any action inconsistent with exclusive representation or exclusive brokerage relationship agreements that other REALTORS® have with clients. (Amended 1/04)"
16-2 further clarifies the purpose of the rule to say that it was intended to prohibit two specific actions. SOP 16-1 and 16-6 are also pertinent to this conversation. The assumption that because someone has an exclusive contract with an agent means that other agents can't talk to them just isn't true. A lot more can be done under article 16 than the vast majority of agents want to believe.
The SOP that you reference deals specifically with an agent trying to find out when a listing contract is set to expire.
Cameron Piper
This is the type of perspective that drives most folks crazy.
Creative marketing? You can put on a gorrilla suit and stand in front of the home, but if it is overvalued then it's not going to sell. Sorry but that's a fact.
Hit as hard? The seller hasn't gotten any offers at his listing price. What more do you need to realize that it is because it's overvalued?
Patience? Like when...this winter? or wait until more foreclosures come onto the market? Sellers better get the memo and sell now because otherwise it's going to be a rough 12-18 months.
I admire some RE agents, while others just don't have the economics background or education to make sense of the world they live in.
I think holding a Bachelor's degree should be a requirement for RE agents.
exclusively with another broker.
~~~~~~~~~~~
None of us are "soliciting" this listing. We are allowed, when approached, to answer questions by the currently listed owner, without interfering with the client/agent relationship.
re: underpricing as a strategy: Very carefully, and on a case by case basis. This could easily backfire.
Here's another SOP that I believe does cover this case:
Standard of Practice 16-4
REALTORS® shall not solicit a listing which is currently listed
exclusively with another broker. However, if the listing broker, when
asked by the REALTOR®, refuses to disclose the expiration date and
nature of such listing; i.e., an exclusive right to sell, an exclusive
agency, open listing, or other form of contractual agreement between
the listing broker and the client, the REALTOR® may contact the owner
to secure such information and may discuss the terms upon which
the REALTOR® might take a future listing or, alternatively, may take a
listing to become effective upon expiration of any existing exclusive
listing. (Amended 1/94)
What is your opinoin of underpricing a property as a marketing strategy?
Deborah
~~~~~~~~~
The market IS very rough, but lowering the price, isn't always the answer. Markets like Minnesota, and the Chicago area haven't been hit as hard as some of the California areas... sometimes it's just a matter of patience and creative marketing.
Think about this: what if your price is too high and your agent knows it. Do you think they're going to spend a bunch of money to market a property that is way overvalued?
RE agents aren't magicians, they are just people doing the best job they can to help sellers and buyers reach their goals. Many RE agents are having trouble putting food on the table and a whiney seller isn't very palatable right now.
Lower your price and you might get an offer. ;)
If your agent is unavaiable, I would suggest you contact the Broker. The Broker has a responsibiity for your listing, and would want to know about your concerns. Some agents work under contracts with their brokers where the agent pays for the advertising and promotion. In other models, the broker pays. If the broker handles the marketing, the broker will be able to outline for you what has been done on your listing.
Good Luck
Deborah
You should really ask your agent for a report of everything that has been done, there may be more there than you think. It is sadly uncommon, but a weekly report of all the activity that has been done is a fantastic way to keep clients up to date. If you were hoping for something more from your agent, tell them.
Your agent should have someone there to cover their business while they are gone. Just becuase they are out of town doesn't mean nothing is being done on your sale. Everyone is entitled to take a vacation and if you have kids you might take a couple during the summer.
Lastly, you get what you pay for in real estate (or at least should). If you hired a discount brokerage to handle your listing, you shouldn't expect full service. Let us know how else we can be of assistance.
Cameron Piper
If my realtor was around, we could meet and discuss. Apparently, they are on another vacation.
Tim - I appreciate your offer, but the others are right. It's a bit sleazy .
I don't want to pick a fight here so that isn't my purpose for posting back, but I wouldn't be so quick to rush to judgement on Tim's post. Your opinion is a common misunderstanding of Article 16 of the Realtor's Code of Ethics.
SOP 16-2 States:
Article 16 is intended to recognize as unethical two basic types of solicitations:
First, telephone or personal solicitations of property owners who have been identified by a real estate sign, multiple listing compilation, or other information service as having exclusively listed their property with another REALTOR®; and
Second, mail or other forms of written solicitations of prospects whose properties are exclusively listed with another REALTOR® when such solicitations are not part of a general mailing but are directed specifically to property owners identified through compilations of current listings, “for sale” or “for rent” signs, or other sources of information required by Article 3 and Multiple Listing Service rules to be made available to other REALTORS® under offers of subagency or cooperation. (Amended 1/04)
Tims post was neither of the two prohibited practices as outlined above.
**********************************************************************************
Tim,
Your post is going to rub people the wrong way (both consumers and agents alike). As a whole this message board is set up for agents to help people. In fact the community guidelines frown on solicitation here. It really goes back to the first truth of running a real estate business: take care of people and the business will follow.
Cameron Piper
I am respectfully going to ask you to hold off on any firing until you have a little more information.
The big issue that drives sellers crazy is unmet expectations.
When you first sat down and interviewed your Realtor, and then you decided to trust them with the sale of your home, what plan did you agree would be implemented? What results were expected, and what was the response or changes to be made?
I would call your Realtor and ask them to have a meeting. At that meeting ask them to present the following:
1. A weekly summary of the marketing steps they have taken
2. A weekly summary of all responses to marketing, includes number of broker calls, buyer calls, hits on their website, Realtor.com
3. A list of homes, like yours, that have come on the market since your home has been on the market
4. A list of homes that have reduced their price, gone into escrow, or expired (failed to sell).
The fact is that the Realtors have not been on vacation since February. Lots of homes of been sold, and the fact that yours has not sold is unfortunate. Buyers are looking for value. The easiest way to increase value is to lower your price.
When a home is listed it receives the most showing activity during the first 30 days. In most markets homes sell for the highest offer price compared to list price during the first 30 days. If there are no showings, assuming all else is equal, then the price is too high. I expect 10-12 showings in the first two weeks. In most markets 10-12 showings will result in one offer, in slower markets it may take more.
You should also know that the buyer that sees the home the buy for the very first time sees it with a REaltor. So if you want to sell, you need to get the Realtors to show your home, and most Realtors will not spend time showing over-priced listings.
After this meeting, you should have a very clear picture of your situation. I helped a client get a home sold in another state. He hired a Realtor, and he complained to me that his home wasn't selling and he needed to move. I referred him to another Realtor. He evalauated the situation, recommended a significant price reduction, got it, and it sold in two weeks.
My friend's priority was to move, he was willing to pay to move because that is what was most important. The amount you paid, the amount, you owe, and amount you need to net...none of that matters to buyers.
IF you need help, give me a call 1-888-284-2056.
It sounds like you should have fired your realtor a long time ago. If you are not happy with the service you are receiving then there is not reason for you to continue working with an agent you don't like. In your situation I would contact your agent and tell them you are not longer interested in working with them and would like to sign a cancellation of the listing agreement. In today's market your agent must be spending money on marketing and getting your home in front of as many people as possible. For example I market all of my listings on over 50 websites on the interenet. I have paid for premium placement on over 30 of them. Some of the sites I list have premium placement on are Google.com, Yahoo.com, Trulia.com, Zillow.com, Craigslist.com, RealEstate.com, Realtor.com and many many more..............
I would be happy to show you what I have to offer and this might help you in your search for an agent that will get your home SOLD quicker and for more money.
Thanks,
