Home Buying in Simi Valley>Question Details

Ap.silverscr…, Home Buyer in Simi Valley, CA

how do I find out who made a counter offer on a house I bought 3.5 years ago?

Asked by Ap.silverscreenpictures, Simi Valley, CA Wed Jan 13, 2010

Made an offer on the house April 2006, there was a counter offer, we revised our offer and it was accepted. I'd like to know who made the counter offer.

Help the community by answering this question:


So, you want to seek damages because 1. you willingly agreed to a price and 2. a bank approved your for it and gave you a loan on a value that wasn't realistic?

I don't know how things work in California, but where I'm from the seller doesn't have to disclose the terms of any other offers on their property unless they want to.

Do you really think that there was a 'fake buyer' who offered an inflated price which 'forced' you to pay an even higher price?

I would either move on with your life like everyone else has to, or prolong the misery and find an attorney and spend countless dollars trying un-pop a real estate bubble that has crippled the majority of California.

OR Maybe I'm just a total idiot and don't understand the question.....
2 votes Thank Flag Link Wed Jan 13, 2010
Hi AP.

Well, it sounds like you need an attorney. Title information would be able to provide you with details about the previous owner and tracking someone down is going to be the work of an investigator, who an attorney should have a relationship with. There may be information that the agent and their broker could be compelled to share during the process. I would still have most of my file documentation from three years ago and that would including information on offers tendered.

But here's the thing and you dont know me and may hate me for saying so but in the end, the responsibility sounds like it lies with your choices. You may have been, like many people were, excited to get an opportunity to purchase a home, probably a home that is fantastic and a bit more than even you thought you could afford in the long run. You probably, like many, took a loan that made sense at the time given the continuous climb in house values and all of the reports, including what I consider to be a smudge on the real estate industry, reporting that they did not see a bubble, but you probably did have the knowledge of the housing industry cycles. You may have encountered a down turn in your own economics that make the situation even worse. And who could blame you for not making a different choice. Realtors, loan brokers, construction people, and more made the same choice you did.

Even as a Realtor, I saw the price of my own home jump to more than twice what I paid for it. I took a substantial second to what I considered to be a conservative about 60% of my value. I'm a little upside down and that was OK because it fit my budget at the time. We have managed to this point because we didnt go lavish and we have fixed loans with nice interest rates but I know even with my conservative choice, it is tough to think about the cost vs value and I know how hard it is for other household because I only have to look at my own situation and multiply it a bit.

Everyone is affected in some way or another about the choices individuals made and the irresponsible lending practices. BUT, the reversal of credit flow has burdened the problem further. Self employed people who work with a different tax structure and therefore usually have very low personal income, consistently cant qualify for home loans in this market and therefore, less buyers equals less competition for homes and lower home price, especially in the over 700,000 price range. So, every choice we make as individuals and as a society have an affect, sometimes a good one, sometimes not so good.

If you are getting by and just upset about your situation, then get by and know that someday your house will be worth more, I think thats a reliable prediction. If you are hanging on, and find yourself throwing good money after bad, look at your options. I have seen successful mortgage loan modifications, including principal reductions, you can negotiate this by yourself if you are extremely dilligent. If you are upside down and cant qualify for a loan modification because you "wouldnt qualify to purchase your home today" then consider a short sale. If you have not refinanced since your original purchase loans, you could, with proper representation and legal review, perhaps short sale without a defiency repayment agreement. Then, you can start again to work toward affordable home ownership. You can maybe think about it the same we we restart other areas of our lives. No one wants to go through a divorce and start again but sometimes it is just the circumstance we find ourselves in and we rebuild, right? It's no easy and it's not simple, it just is.

I'm in the business of selling people homes but when I read your post, it makes me feel like you have a lot of resentment about your situation and it cant be good to live in the four walls that remind you of it. While homeownership is paramount in milestones to Americans, it is only one facet of our lives. Good luck and please contact me if I can assist you further.
Web Reference: http://www.SimiLiving.com
1 vote Thank Flag Link Wed Jan 13, 2010
Hello again,
The current U.S. housing market and national financial crisis has caused untold stress and heartache for many American families. Foreclosure is one of the most devastating financial challenges that a family can face and one that many times can be avoided. The options available to Ventura County area residents facing foreclosure are many. We have posted a daily plethora of updated links to vital resources for homeowners on our website.
0 votes Thank Flag Link Thu Apr 15, 2010
You weren't just a 50+ buyer in 2006, you were an 80+ buyer!
0 votes Thank Flag Link Thu Jan 14, 2010
Hi AP, Well, I am really sorry for your sitation and I moved into my home 7 years ago and the Sellers mail still comes to the home, important things. For a while, I even dropped the mail at her work, to be kind (my husband when to school with her). Oh well, some people just arent as mindful of their stuff as others.

Anyway, from what you mention, you seem like you would be very eligible for a short sale. I am experienced with that but my guess is that you may have a feeling for who you would be most comfortable with consulting about this choice, from the responses you received here. If I were in your shoes, I would select one or two local people from these many responses and contact them directly to arrange to meet with them to learn more about them and the process and then go from there. Whatever you do, dont stick your head in the sand at this point, as long as you are in posession of the home, you can try and steer the result into the best direction possible for your outcome.
Web Reference: http://www.SimiLiving.com
0 votes Thank Flag Link Thu Jan 14, 2010
Hello again,

I'd like to assist you in finding a suitable rental in Leisure Village, Camarillo, CA. We can also help you, should you decide to short sale the property, and therefore stay in the home for half a year or longer, possibly. Have you explored a loan modification? As a senior, there are a lot of government and non-profit organizations that can provide assistance as well. I have posted a lot of information about Short Sales in Ventura County and Simi Valley on our website: http://www.findsimivalleyhomes.com/custom8.aspx

Also, I have rentals posted and updated on our Leisure Village Camarillo site. Good luck, and please get in touch with people you can trust right away. You are not alone in this. Over 700 homes went into NOD status last month alone in Ventura County.
0 votes Thank Flag Link Wed Jan 13, 2010
I do empathize with your situation. I would think you could talk to the postal service in regards to sending mail back to a dead file or forwarding it when it comes with that persons name on it.
You also might want to check with your loan company regarding obtaining a loan modification to your loan and the possibility of adjusting your payment level.
I do not think dwelling on the counter offer situation will really help anything at this point except heighten your unhappiness. If the payments are too much for you currently you also can certainly contact the bank in regards to doing a "short sale". This would enable you to sell due to hardship.
Hope this helps!
Janis Calkins
Ventura Property Shoppe
0 votes Thank Flag Link Wed Jan 13, 2010
I was a 50 plus first time buyer, had really no idea what I was getting into, didn't even realize I was being given an interest only 2nd mortgage. Yes, it is my fault. Fact is I didn't really want to buy, was more than happy renting an apartment - had lived there 17 years - but my husband thought it would be good for us and our jobs moved out to this area so the drive would be shorter.

My anger re: previous owner stems from the fact that this person never changed his address - even his checks have my address on them, his bank statements came to our address, his phone bill, even paperwork for property owned in a different state. Problem is I have the same bank, same phone company and do get mail for the state his other property is in. There was even vandalism to our vehicles because people didn't know he had moved. It's just keeps piling up.

I have learned my lesson as a home buyer but there's no second-time home buyer incentives and I don't see how a bank could expect someone who is 85 years old to come up with $4000 a month for a mortgage payment. Of course, I never thought about it at the time myself, have a hard time picturing myself that age.

Anyway, just wanted to know if I could get the name to make sure I wasn't being paranoid.

Thanks for letting me rage on-
0 votes Thank Flag Link Wed Jan 13, 2010
Aha. Well, gee, that's going to be a tough road to go down.

In addition to Aaron's accounting, you're also angry at your Seller's actions over the past three-and-a-half years, as if that has anything to do with #s 1 & 2.

I'm thinking that you're reading too many bubble blogs, which I know isn't the answer you want - you want us to tell you how to force your Seller or their agent to turn over the other bidder's offer to you, which is probably only going to happen if a judge orders it done.

To tell you the truth, I've never heard of anyone suing for "undisclosed damages." What I have heard of is suing for "specific damages," but that's another matter.

Demonstrating that the Seller is responsible for "the real estate practices of the period" promises to be difficult, and your argument that Wells Fargo "should have never given you a loan" is going to require more than just a simple assertion.

I think you're just stuck.
0 votes Thank Flag Link Wed Jan 13, 2010
Are you then actually looking for the person who owned the property before you? I wonder why you suspect another party made the counter offer--If you believe that there were misrepresentaions, why not contact an attorney who specializes in real estate and seek his/her advice--then take it from there.

0 votes Thank Flag Link Wed Jan 13, 2010
The reason I was asking was because of the questionable actions of the previous owner over the last 3.5 years since buying the house. I feel the owner may have mis-represented who was actually making the counter offer. I have been trying to find the owner to be able to file a lawsuit for undisclosed damages.

While I feel we paid for a home that had an artificially inflated price tag because of the real estate practices of the period and had been taken advantage of by Wells Fargo (we should never have been given a loan and wouldn't have been given one a few years prior to this period of "who the hell cares, I want my money now" and I doubt that we'd get a loan today) I don't see anyway to sell.

Thanks for your time.
0 votes Thank Flag Link Wed Jan 13, 2010
HI AP Silverscreen,

I wonder, why do you want to know. Some agents seem to think you are concerned about fraud, that maybe there wasnt really another offer, but when I read this, I thought that maybe you are considering selling the home and thought the best opportunity might be to go back to the other interested party. But, I really wonder WHY you want to know. Please post a response with a bit more information.

Things have changed so much since 2006, if you concerned about fraud, the issue of another competing offer will probably not serve you well and you probably should seek legal advice.

If you are interested it reselling the property, you should research a few Realtors who you think might be a good pick for you and interview them to see who is the best fit. If you are thinking that selling direct will yield you a few dollars shaved off costs, you may want to consider the advantages of getting the word out to many about your homes sale.

If you are under water and you think loan modification or short sale is one of your last resorts, look for professional representation that has no up front costs to you and make sure you get someone with experience that is well recommended AND well researched. I would be happy to help you further please contact me directly if I can assist you.
Web Reference: http://www.SimiLiving.com
0 votes Thank Flag Link Wed Jan 13, 2010
I agree with Janis. This is an unusual request. Since they countered you and you didn't get the property, there was probably a multiple counter offer situation. The information on who is the owner is public record, but the information on others who didn't get the property is not public record for obvious reasons.
0 votes Thank Flag Link Wed Jan 13, 2010
Could you be a bit more specific in your question? Sounds like the seller made the counter offer to me, if it was on the house you currently own. Usually a buyer makes an offer, the seller will counter offer and the buyer then accepts the counter or counters back to the seller again. I am curious as to why you would want this information now.
Please feel free to contact me personally if I can be of further help.
0 votes Thank Flag Link Wed Jan 13, 2010
Sorry to hear that you bought in the height of the market. If you were in a multiple-counter offer situation, the Buyer is not entitled to know who the other offer was from, nor what it's price and terms are/were. I believe the statute for real estate offers is three years. The brokers may have destroyed the records already, anyway. Good luck in your research....
0 votes Thank Flag Link Wed Jan 13, 2010

It would be pretty difficult to get the information. Californina DRE requires brokers to keep records for 3 years. You would have to ask the Broker who represented the Seller to give you that information and they have no obligation to do as their obligation was to their client.

Now if they represented you and the Seller on that transaction and you can prove that the Broker was doing something wrong; then you would have to take the proper actions to get access to those records. Again remembering that the broker does not have to maintain those records any longer as the three year period is up.
Web Reference: http://www.homebuysblog.com
0 votes Thank Flag Link Wed Jan 13, 2010
The counter-offer would have been made by the Seller. What you're referring to is, "the other offer," and the answer is, after this much time, you probably don't find out who made it.
0 votes Thank Flag Link Wed Jan 13, 2010
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