So the next step would be to determine if the wall they moved was a load bearing wall. If it was you would need to determine how they compensated vertical load displacement for that.
You should have a contractor measure the existing interior bathroom walls and then take a dive under the crawl space and there should be a corresponding load bearing post (pier) and beam directly under one of the walls to neutralize the point load of the load bearing wall.
I know this sounds confusing to a lay person but an experienced foundation contractor would be able to spot that in a nano second.
If it has an exterior window then that resolves the ventilation issue.
If it had a preexisting toilet, sink and small shower chances are your good to go with plumbing vents as well. However, you may want to once again have your contractor git on the roof and check to see if the roof vents directly above that bathroom correspond to the plumbing fixtures.
It sounds like it has all the potential for a historical home so I can see why you're so bent on keep the deal together. All in all, however, if the building jurisdiction will allow you an "AS BUILT" permit (that's what they call them in San Diego. They may have a different name in Riverside County) and everything pans out with the inspections I'd feel pretty positive about pulling the trigger.
However, having said that, if your really passionate about this property I wouldn't necessarily let the bathroom situation be the only deal breaker. Worse case scenario is you'd have to revert it back to what it was which is still a bathroom. Again good luck and I hope this helps.
If it isn't and you want to acheive that status and expect to make a home out of it for the long haul you will definitely want to cross your T's and dot your I's. Go the distance and make sure all your concerns are addressed before you pull the procerbial trigger and get stuck with something that will give you everything but joy and pride.
I know the Redlands area very well and you are in a very good neighborhood with lots of very fine folks. You'll be very happy raising your family and spending the rest of your life there should you choose to do so. I really can't add much more information or advice than you've already received and I think most of your issues and concerns have been addressed.
I would like to thank you for your participation and ongoing feedback on this thread and for being so generous
with your acknowledgement and recognition for all those who contributed to you. It's always gratifying to know that ones advice isn't falling on deaf ears. You'd be surprised to know how many folks ask this forum a question and recieve literally dozens of answers only to never return or at least let us know they did so.
Good luck and may you have years of fullfillment with your home.
You are in the steep part of a learning and expense curve! Do the right thing. Its nice to "meet" online and everything,but, for the sake of your investment; make sure your take the time to be a great consumer and get estimates, use the most qualified people you can etc.. call your inspector for more information if you feel they are qualified to dispense it!!!
If you are overwhelmed, which is reasonable of course, reduce that emotion with a rational procedure like documenting what is going on, the list of things you are concerned with( and why) and the steps you feel are best to help proceed to your esteemed satisfaction. It will save you time, energy and give you a good night's sleep. You can mess around with the list all you want, the tangible and malleable aspect of it will provide comfort and support. You can make up your own method to counteract potentially distracting emotions like worry and stress of course..
You can't change a thing with worry. You are obviously in the position to buy a house in Redlands; enjoy ALL of it! Maybe you will buy this house, maybe you won't ...it all happens for a reason...,,if I've seen it once, I've seen it a thousand times...
The inspector did go into the crawl spaces and under neath that specific bathroom. The "S" trap is for the sink in that new bathroom as well as the older bathroom and kitchen dishwasher. Of course I am probably leaving something out that would put it all together nicely for those of you that know all the terms. But, that is how I understood it.
Thank you ALL so much for all your answers.
Now that you have shed a bit more light. It appears as though you have one of those situations where the foot print was changed and like a lot of owners who do these kind of rennovations the prior owner did not want to hassle with getting permitts.
It seems like you really only have a couple of ways to go on this.
1. Find a new home.
2.Buy the home as is. Do nothing and wait and see if a building inspector shows up.( Not likely)
3. Buy the home, pull permitts and have the building inspector out to inspect. If you go this route you should know that you will most likely be asked to open up previously rennovated walls and floors to give the inspector access to plumbing, electrical, gas, structure and the like.
The city has the home listed as a 3 bedroom 1 bath, home size 1469 square feet and lot 8200 square feet.
I did some research and when the home was sold (in 2008 before the current seller) there was pictures of a second "bathroom" (which included a toilet and a sink and possibly a really small shower. The current seller completely redid this area and put in a much bigger shower built in not fiber glass stuff, all tile. Moved the toilet and the sink. The city has no footprint on this home as it is 100 years old. There is note of a renovation in the 1030s but nothing recent of any bathroom work. The bathroom does have windows, but no vents, no tub.
I agree with you about it sounding fishy that they would put so much work and money into it but not get a permit for it. We really like the home, and we like the area where the home is located. But don't want to take the risk to move in, if this bathroom will be a problem down the line, specially if we decide to get it permitted in the future.
I hope that answers some of your questions.
Is this a full sized bath with a tub and shower, lavatory and toilet? Are all the plumbing fixtures mentioned properly ventilated? If so how? Did they run it up through the roof with a standard 2 inch ABS vent pipe? or is it an interior Air admittance valve (AAV) which you would find under your sink for the sink, however, how is the toilet and bath/shower vented.
These are some things that a general contractor doesn't always catch If you're really in love with this home and it's a must have I'd go the extra distance and hire an experienced plumbing contractor to do a thorough inspection of the items mentioned above. It just sounds a little fishy to me that if the bath were done so nicely why they didn't follow through with a permit.
If the plumbing contractor gives you a positive report and you still wish to move forward you can always appeal to the building department for an "AS IS" permit. Most building departments will generally issue these without much of a problem.
But no matter what since the bathroom wasn't permitted it cannot be allowed or counted as viable square footage and you should be able to adjust the asking price accordingly. Hope this helps.
@ Tammy and Ann we had a contractor look at the bathroom and said that it looks really well done and he doesn't understand why the seller didn't get a permit. Our inspector today said that things look really good some things need to be changed with the plumbing (something do to with an S trap) but other than that it was all new stuff in this bathroom. What the city told me that scared me was that they could come in and ask us to tear it down if it didn't meet code (they said not likely) but it would be our problem once we bought the home.
Glad you responded, things aren't looking so good. :(
The appraisal appreciated the home at 94% in 4 months based on the unpermitted improvements done, as well as comps. Seller bought house for 100,000 is selling for 189,900 and it was appraised at 197,000. We offered the full asking price as recommended by our agent. We feel the appraisal is not correct, because we were told that when appraised the appraiser would not count the unpermitted areas as validation but the appraiser did. We are so confused. Leaning towards pulling out, waiting to hear back from our second opinion lender, he saw a lot of red flags we started from scratch with new lender for second opinion and we are having to pay for another appraisal, since our current lender obtained our current appraisal without having us sign the release for him to do so. Current lender states that's a RESPA violation.... too complicated to explain all here but things are not looking good for us. But hey you guys have been helpful in helping us see all of this.
Just to give you guys an update:
Appraiser included all unpermitted work in appraisal, even though our lender told us that all unpermitted work could not be included. Now the home shows a 94% appreciation in less than 4 months and our second opinion lender thinks that's a red flag. So back to worrying ago, but trying to move forward.