I know this sounds cliche but things sometimes work out for the best. I know Paul, and he will be a great resource for you.

Janice

Kelly,

We just finished talking to our agent. We've told him that we're cutting ties with him and that the house was our last transaction with him. Thank you for giving Paul's number. We've decided to walk away from the house as much as we really like the house. :(

The seller agent said that it's too late, he's now entertaining the other offer and it's inappropriate for us to talk to him in the first place anyway (we heard this from our buyer agent).

Thank you again.

Hi MikeandTracy - I am sorry you are having to go through this. It greatly concerned me that you are having so many problems with a fellow KW Realtor, so I printed this thread out and showed it to my Reviewing Broker. He has asked me to let you know that he would be happy to help in any way and has asked me to give you his name and number so that you can call him. His name is Paul Buss and his Cell Phone is 503-896-1475. Paul has been in this business for many many years and would be able to help you coordinate with your Realtor to get this resolved.

Best of luck to you.
Kelly Gebler, Broker
Your Nines Team @ Keller Williams Realty

UPDATE:

We didn't get any call from our agent, and at 11:45 am, we finally called our agent to find out our status with the house (we tried calling his reviewer but she's in a meeting so we just left her a message).

Our agent said that the seller agent from the bank sent him an e-mail (early in the morning, we guess) saying that we have until 7 o'clock IN THE MORNING today, to bring the cashier check to the title company. If that didn't happen, he's sending in the other offers to the bank (basically our offer isn't even considered--basically rejected).

Ok, the bank isn't open until 9 in the morning on Monday, and we didn't hear anything from both agents throughout the weekend. We're amazed with the way things go.

Mike and Tracy,

Thank you, I appreciate your reply.

This is a tough market right now with short sales and REO and it seems normal rules of engagement don't apply like they used to. I'm glad you appreciate the efforts of your current agent and frankly it is a challenge negotiating with banks especially right now. I hope there is a way to work through this with your agent and his broker. The principle broker is there for both you and your agent when things become extraordinary and may even be welcomed by your agent. Keller Williams has excellent Reviewing Brokers and I know I can come to mine whenever I need assistance I bet yours can too.

I hope your next post is one with good news.

Janice

Excuse us,
we mixed up Kelly and Janice in our previous answer.

Thank you both for your inputs, Janice, we didn't think you were implying that Kelly was being unethical. She only shares her general experience, and for that, Kelly, we really appreciate it as well.

We think we may have to talk to our agent's principal broker per your suggestion, Janice. We don't want to get our agent in 'trouble' though. Sure we feel quite underrepresented and confused, but he's actually the only agent we've had (he's our third agent--we've been looking for awhile now) who actually always makes time to show us houses and actually calls back when we do call him (the others don't do that so we decide to stick with our current one), but when it comes to making offers, negotiating with sellers, we don't feel satisfied.

The problem is we still want the house. We feel like we're in 'limbo' because we don't understand/know where we stand with this process anymore. If our offer has been 'rejected' (per seller agent basically blurted out after Mike refused to pay the title company the earnest money unless we've gotten an acceptance) or if the offer still stands and be forwarded to the Bank (since we've not yet withdrawn our offer and so far, they imply ours was their strongest offer without the acceptance).

Tsk. We'll see on Monday.

Hello Mike and Tracy

I want to follow up on my previous post. In hindsight it might be misunderstood that I was implying that Kelly may have responded to you in an inappropriate or unethical manner. That was or is not my intent. Certainly she is an experienced Realtor with many transactions under her belt and answered in a way she feels most helpful. In your latest comment you had attributed her answers to me. We both thoughtfully responded in a manner that we thought was appropriate to your question. She did a great job of explaining the general process and offered her services. For me I thought it would be better to recommend that you seek professional legal advice outside of Trulia and explained I would not have provided those answers to what is a unique situation. Two different points of view.

At the end of day I wish you well, and I know she wants the best for you as well.

Janice Lorentz

Hello Mike and Tracy,

You have responded to Kelly's answers regarding title and the $100 penalty for delayed closing. I did not make specific comments about your situation. It would not be appropriate for me to do so, in fact I feel it is ethically wrong to do so without being your agent let alone not seeing your documents. That is why my advice was to seek legal council since you sounded unrepresented.

However you are represented by an agent and I do have an opinion regarding this transaction that raises concerns. You have every right to contact the reviewing broker for your agent and should do so as soon as possible. Every office has a reviewing broker (principle broker) who at the end of day holds final responsibility for representing your side of the transaction.

I wish you well and hope this will be cleared up quickly for you.

Janice Lorentz, Licensed Oregon Broker
Keller Williams Realty, Portland Premier.

Thanks for the answers, Janice and Kelly.

We have an agent with Keller Williams and it seems that he's pretty clueless with the process. He can't answer most of our questions.

Just asking because we think that it's not right to give our earnest money to a title company when we're not accepted yet. In fact, our realtor let us call the seller agent via his cell phone yesterday evening. Seller agent said that either we gave that cashier check to the title company asap, then MAYBE our offer is accepted by the Bank or our offer will be rejected--word by word what he said. Mike says, I'm not going to give your title company a cashier check before I have a confirmation that the Bank that our offer is accepted. The seller agent said 'Then you're rejected.' He hung up.
We left, then 30 minutes later, he e-mailed our realtor and seemed like to have a change of heart. He said instead of a cashier check, he asked us to submit the paperwork that we didn't sign because we didn't agree to what they said in it except that we agree that we're going to pay the amount and we even agreed with moving up the closing date.

We disagreed with most of the clauses in the forms the Bank sent to us, and we're NOT signing it. We really wanted to stick with our original contract. The only contingency we have that they provide us with title insurance. Our agent pretty much is following the seller agent's direction and we have to really stress to him we don't agree with it.

Janice, you mentioned that the bank usually doesn't know the defects on the title,but since they're the sellers they need to provide us with a free and clear title, how are they going to do that if they're not willing to pay for it?

P.S. Janice, the bank did put a clause that they will charge the buyers $100 either a day or a week if we dont' close on appointed date, which is 8 business days after our 'offer/possible verbal 'yes''
From our experience, it took quite awhile to do title search.

Hi MikeandTracy - I list lots of bank owned homes.....and each bank seems to have their own set of quirks with their docs. And I also completely agree with Janice in that you need to have a good Realtor that knows how the REO process works representing you.

Most of what you said is pretty common when buying an REO. The buyer writes their offer on our standard Oregon Earnest Money Agreement paperwork and, in most instances, the listing agent will either email only the details of the offer or enter the details online through whatever portal the bank is using to present offers. The bank will respond, again usually via email, to their listing agent with an acceptance and send their version of the contracts for you to sign. Once signed, the listing agent then puts the whole package together that includes your original offer and their paperwork and sends them off to the bank for their signatures. Even though they have agreed to your offer via email - they are the last ones to sign everything. It normally takes 2-7 days to get banks signatures back....but I've seen some that have take 2-3 weeks! In the meantime, some bank's paperwork states that all your contingencies and closing time starts ticking at the point of their verbal acceptance and others state it begins upon written acceptance. That's where you really want to read the contract to see when they are starting counting from. And they have to include a real date for closing, not just "29 days after accepted offer" so it sounds like they started counting your 29 days from verbal acceptance. Most cash offers are being written with a 14 day closing period so that may have also caused a change. Offers that have financing involved - the banks are usually making the closing date a full 45 days from acceptance (even if that's longer than you need) to make sure that the buyer has plenty of time. There's almost always a Per Diem charge to the buyer for each day they close after the agreed date, so to make sure the buyer doesn't incur that fee - they extend the closing date.

As for your Earnest Money check....most banks require a photo copy of that to go with your offer, the real check would remain with your buyer's agent and not be turned over to the title company until the offer has been accepted.

In all instances of buying a home, you are to receive clear and marketable title to the deed and the title company will be responsible for running that search and will provide you with a Preliminary Title Report within a few days of escrow beign set up. You will have 5 days to review that report and make sure it's acceptable. Because these banks take these properties back via foreclosure - they don't have any knowledge about defects against the deed until that title search has begun. When you buy a home and have financing - the amount of your loan determines the amount of title insurance needed.....because you are paying cash - that may be why they are saying they are not providing title insurance. You can talk to the title officer about the options you have regarding title insurance and whether you could obtain that for yourself.

I hope that helps clear up some of what you were asking. If you have other questions or would like some help or your own representation from someone who knows how this process works - just give a call. My team would love to help!

Kelly Gebler, Broker
Your Nines Team
Keller Williams Realty
503-516-1637

Dear Mike and Tracy.

Everything that you are saying here suggests to me that you are not represented by an agent. There are a few concerns that I have just based on what you said here. Ideally if you chose not to be represented by a Realtor you should have an attorney to assist you. If you have not done so already I recommend that you seek legal counsel immediately. These questions are best answered by an attorney with your contract in hand for his/her review rather than on a forum like this.

Best Wishes,
Janice Lorentz, Licensed Oregon Broker.
Keller Williams Realty, Portland Premiere.