What is your point Phil...?

**..You can take a client around for months and they never buy something, you can advertise a property that never sells ..you make absolutely nothing - but you still pay out-of-pocket and you still pay all your fees..**



If you're a basic plumber, electrician or even a registered carpenter you have the cost of doing business ... you have dues, cost of tools, in some cases they run well over $2,000 a year .. people in the Post Office pay for their own uniforms, UPS drivers pay for theirs -- you have to spend money to make money, it's the flea's that come with the dog.

If you're spending lots of money and time and your clients aren't buying, then you need to be in another line of work ... let's face it, there is a bunch of agents out there that shouldn't be in the business ..

The only thing that kept most agents buoyant in the last 5 years was an exploding market and lenders that were buying dead people with a pulse ...

So it was pretty much "order taking" on a vast scale, no skill needed there ... much like selling green beer and St Patty's day ..

Stop and think about .. what do you think is going to happen in the next 12 months without a counterfeit real estate market in place.? .. your NAR thinks you'll lose 20% of your realtors, I think it will be much more than that..l.o.l..


;^)

Sun Apr 13 2008, 03:00

Just to set the record straight, the costs of being an agent are a little more substantial than you have stated. Yes you take a 63 hour class. This is NOT available on-line in Florida - you sit in a classroom for 8 days, 8 -5. Before you take the test, pay $61 for fingerprints. Once you pass the course, you take the state exam, a $25 test. Now you join MLS @ $950 per year, Buy a lockbox key, @ $250 per year. Now you find a broker. If you have no experience, you probably go to a traditional broker and pay a monthly fee plus do a commission split - the broker gets a percent of your 3% and you get the rest - there are many programs. Next you have advertising fees, promotion fees, etc.. You can take a client around for months and they never buy something, you can advertise a property that never sells - you make absolutely nothing - but you still pay out-of-pocket and you still pay all your fees. Being an agent is not a cushy job - its hard work if you are doing a good job - it is a rewarding job when you can actually make a living and have satisfied clients.

Sat Apr 12 2008, 05:20

Buyers believe that if they do not work with a realtor they can get a better price and using the MLS themselves they can more effectively search and screen properties.

The realty is that it is difficult to get a better price without using an agent because the standard listing agents have a 6% commission built-in. As a buyer, you can write an offer that rebates 3% back to you if you do not use an agent. Or more practically, as a buyer you use a realtor that will upfront agree to rebate a portion of their commission to you (ziprealty realty 20%, others up to 80%) in advance.

I am seriously thinking about getting a realtor license myself after reading the requirements. This is not like getting a college degree. In fact in FL all you need is:
a) a high school degree
b) a set of classes--can be completed online. total time investment 63 hrs ($245.00)
c) pass a state exam ($35.00) then pay $145.00 to get a license

This exam isn't rocket science; a sample question with a common sense answer:
A person want to act as his own general contractor to build a home
would consult which document to determine the amount of
insulation required by law?
A. zoning ordinance
B. home warranty
C. plans & specs
D. building code

Sat Apr 12 2008, 01:37

Buyers believe that if they do not work with a realtor they can get a better price and using the MLS themselves they can more effectively search and screen properties.

The realty is that it is difficult to get a better price without using an agent because the standard listing agents have a 6% commission built-in. As a buyer, you can write an offer that rebates 3% back to you if you do not use an agent. Or more practically, as a buyer you use a realtor that will upfront agree to rebate a portion of their commission to you (ziprealty realty 20%, others up to 80%) in advance.

I am seriously thinking about getting a realtor license myself after reading the requirements. This is not like getting a college degree. In fact in FL all you need is:
a) a high school degree
b) a set of classes--can be completed online. total time investment 63 hrs ($245.00)
c) pass a state exam ($35.00) then pay $145.00 to get a license

This exam isn't rocket science; a sample question with a common sense answer:
A person want to act as his own general contractor to build a home
would consult which document to determine the amount of
insulation required by law?
A. zoning ordinance
B. home warranty
C. plans & specs
D. building code

So it takes around $500.00 and a bit of self study!!! In fact, if you are a lawyer, you don't even need to take the class. You can just sit for the test. There are even Cliff Notes to help you pass the test. It actually is a fantastic investment, even if you just buy once depending on home price. If you purchase a $1M home, for $500.00, you get $29,500 back.

Sat Apr 12 2008, 00:39

Some Uneducated people think RE are ripping off, and think we get paid too much. They just don't understand that the RE agents will look upon their client and try to get the best price for the purchase, not a win/lose situation, but a win/win. Sorry I don't rip off the buyers or sellers of any sides, but I do promise to give my best to represent my side and make sure he/she will get the best price honestly for their money. And for some people thinking, we get paid too much for our service because they don't see this as a business, and job. WE ARE A BUSINESS and we pay taxes and help the economy too. But most of us do work with commission based, and yes this is ok, and yes some of us make over a million per year, yes over, so what? Some make 0 and work for minimum. We work hard, did help the rich and the no so rich to buy a home or an investment and the party most likely will make money or loose money on that. It’s all business, its ok, its how it works, and numbers are big so the % is too or not. So if you look outside the box, travel agents get commission, and also yacht sellers, and stock brokers, and all this doesn’t need to have a professional neither, but the number for the commission is so small, to compare, for the loss you could get or the gain, trying to go in your own, to save a buck. The most successful people do use the services of agents for everything, they do understand theirs business and trust ours. I think they are wise, they don’t want to waist their time, their time is more valuable then any %%%%. Think of that.
So I'm happy, been a PROFESSIONAL REAL AGENT and love this business and treat it like, business, with respect to me and to others. I did grow up inside a business world with my family, so I'm proud of this and think we do deserve to get paid 3%, 6%, 7%, 12%, whatever you think your work is worth.
Good luck to all the agents and people who are involved in real estate.
It’s all beautiful!
PS: I do respect that people for their reasons like to do RE transactions in their own too, just think you are doing a business for yourself, so get educated and try not to loose your hard worked money.

Fri Apr 11 2008, 22:33

I would love a realtor who did that found our perfect house put in offer... one week later nothing no rejection/acception, or counter. Now I do not know what to do but look at other houses. :(

Thu Apr 3 2008, 16:25

Hi Melanie, I am sorry to hear about your experience with a pushy realtor and admit that there are many inept agents out there. The client I am working with right now told me a horror story of a local (Sarasota, FL) agent who actually charged her $2500.00 for showing her 5 properties that did not even meet her criteria. She eventually got all the money back but was deathly afraid to deal with a realtor. I cannot emphasize enough the first step after pre-qualifying for a mortgage is building a relationship with your agent (if you choose to use one). As a realtor, there are agents that I won't deal with because of their manners and ethics. I apologize for your experience but do hope you find someone trustworthy during your search. Good Luck. Judy

Thu Apr 3 2008, 15:50

As a new potential first time home buyer there are many reasons listed below that I agree with. I do not want to find a home in a week and be done with it all. I want to see the various places and price points I can afford. I want to look at a HUGE backyard and a small condo complex with little to no maintence. Buying a home is a BIG deal. I don't want a realtor/agent who is going to push me into something right away just so they can get the commission off the sale. I also do not want them to push me into something I can't afford!

I went to look at a property this weekend, and the listing agent was innitially rude when I made the appointment by telling me that she wanted to talk with my buyers agent to see what I can afford. The day before the viewing she called to change the time she could show me HER listed property because she over-booked herself that weekend. When I showed up to the property the next day she gave me her card, and shuffled me around the place...then she told me that I should look at properties that were $50K MORE than the property I was viewing. She didn't understand my need to set my own budget and tried to turn herself into my buyers agent while I was viewing the property she was listing.

As for right now I don't trust realtors or agents, and with use of the web I can look at properties and make arrangements to view them on my own. Once I have choosen a property that works for me, that I can afford, then I can get an agent who will help me write my offer, and one who will have contacts with an inspector to view the home.

I will not be pushed into something that I can't afford, and I won't be bullied into a property that I don't want. If I can't see the potential in a property on my own, than it isn't the place for me!

Thu Apr 3 2008, 13:21

I think they think they have to pay us if we help them. They are not educated in this area so it is our job to show them the value in having representation. Giving them information and time is a great value they just may not know it.

Thu Apr 3 2008, 13:16

Jozie, I agree with a lot of what you were saying. To finish off your point that not all real estate agents are as good as others, also not all people who are good at market research and negotiations are real estate agents. You may have a lot of the same skills as some of the great real estate agents, but decided to pursue a different career.

My cousin is a police officer. But, he is also excellent carpenter, plans and measurements come natural to him and he has an eye for design. Contractors are often asking him if he wants to pick up side work. He has no training as a carpenter, is not licensed, it just comes natural to him. So, other carpenters may tell him that he is crazy to frame a wall in his basement by himself, but there is no way that he is going to spend money to have someone else do what he knows he can do just as well. When it comes to electrical work, he understands it but would not risk doing it on his own. He hires an electrician. I liken this to hiring an atty when buying a home on your own. You may understand the market very well, and be a great negotiator, but if you don't feel comfortable with the legal documents you can hires someone for that part of the process.

That being said, I do not think that just anyone can successfully buy a house on their own. It is a complicated process. I am just saying that for some people it can be done if they are willing to do their homework.

Thu Apr 3 2008, 06:53

I like to do my own thing in my own way. I have found that this saves thousands of dollars. I, too can search the market and don't need the 'help'. I also manage my own portfolio. I guarantee you I can deal with a seller as well as anyone, cars, real estate, or whatever. Let's face it, not all real estate agents are as good as others. And you never know reading their 'press releases'.

Thu Apr 3 2008, 05:45

Real Estate Pro wrote: When making one of the largest financial decisions of your life consulting an expert just makes good sense..

It is true to the point when buyer is educated enough about the area he/she is looking into (see answers below) and in that case the buyer can make a good decision and save a lot of money.
There were, are, and will be bad and good examples of buying FSBO.
The question was 'why some buyers shy away ...' and it is not a discussion whether they should or should not. It is just answers to the question.
Those are:
1. Some people have fun researching the market
2. Some people want to save money
3. For some peole it is business
4. For some people it is all of the above.
5. For some people it is 'other'

Tue Apr 1 2008, 14:27

This discussion seems to be getting heated and I will add my two cents. I have a few questions for buyers- Do you have dogs you walk regularly? I know of nearby parks that are very dog friendly. I walk my dogs in these parks. Are you athletic or a member of a gym? I belong to a swim team and the facility we meet at has a full gym. I pay 3 bucks to use the gym and do not have to be a member. There are two others within ten miles you may want to check out. Are you highly allergic to mold? There is a home in my neighborhood that had water problems. The seller didn’t use a realtor nor did the buyer. In my state you do not have to use a seller’s disclosure if the home is not listed by an agent. If the buyer had consulted me prior to the purchase I would have suggested tests be performed to insure the problem had been remedied. There was no insurance claim but I had a conversation with the seller before the house went on the market. Do you want a pool? I will give you names of the home owner’s warranty companies that have good coverage for the equipment and a reputation for customer service. Concerned about appreciation? The neighbors of the house someone was buying was about to go into foreclosure. It hadn’t hit a list or shown up on a website yet. My children go to school with the owner’s children and the mother confided in me. How many times have you negotiated with an agent that has someone else’s best interest in mind? Fortunately I have many times and now I could be working for you.

Before I was a realtor I was a loan officer. I will help make an educated decision when obtaining a mortgage loan. I was an appraiser’s apprentice. I will show how an appraiser is likely to value the home being purchased. I am now a real estate broker. I continue to take classes and stay on top of local developments to grow my knowledge of the market. My integrity is top priority. I wouldn’t sell a house to someone that I wouldn’t sell to my own mother.

I agree that some people get into the business and never take the time to become an expert. They do not last long and could potentially leave a wake of unsatisfied buyers and sellers. Most of my business is by referral. So if Aunt Betty tells you she had a good experience you may want to take that into consideration. Furthermore, if your aunt, mother, son or daughter is relocating to my area I think they should consult me or a local realtor. The good news is there are other knowledgeable agents in my area. I know because I have either worked with them or trained them.

My point is clear- Local agents are privy to local information. When making one of the largest financial decisions of your life consulting an expert just makes good sense..

Sun Mar 30 2008, 08:19

Phil,

***.. "Buying and selling a house is no different than buying and selling your car yourself. Some people can do it and some people can't. Some people want to do it and try and fail and others do it with great success .. ***

You're absolutely correct ..

Some people shouldn't try to buy or sell cars, or boats or that grand piano in the living room - or properties - ..and then you have others, like myself, that shouldn't be around paint brushes or sharp tools .. So, I totally agree.


*** .. "I have a neighbor who has been selling his home himself because he is a "retired realtor" . He was over priced 2 years ago and he is still overpriced... ***

That door swings both ways .. your neighbor is a realtor, he's retired .. but years in the business - yes.?

He's been in contact with how many consumers .. 350.? .. 150.? .. 15...??

No matter, he's been in contact with enough people in his life - to "change their life" .. and he's been obviously wrong on his own home for the last 2 years ...

So, now the question arises - how many times has he been wrong with his own clients..?

..70% of the time..? ..

.. 50% of the time..?

... is it safe to say, a mere 25% of the time ..?

...... and how much money did he cost those consumers.??

Do you see where I'm going with this...? .. there's a huge difference between being in the business - and "knowing" the business ..

The point is, there is a lot of agents like your retired neighbor out there that are "in" the business - but they know very little about their business and that's scary ...

Getting NAR updates every week is a far cry from any reality of what goes on in the market ... especially since they are getting pummeled by lawsuits, their own agents and the FTC follows them around like a bad habit ... think about it, who's worse.? .. the NAR or the NRA - it's hard to tell the difference..l.o.l...

I played golf with one of the largest brokers in the south last week ... now, he's had an agent working for him for 9 years and he's "never' sold a home ... but he does get his 25 or 30 listings every fall when his friends come down from the North, and then expire around Easter .l.o.l..

I doubt you'll ask for that listing agents opinion ..and if you really think about it, what experience does that agent possess -- besides zero.



: ^)

Sun Mar 30 2008, 02:58

Much of it has to do with the perception that buying a house is something that you can do on your own just like buying a car or a lawnmower. It is true that people have access to tons of information that was not available before but customers who do it alone have no clue about what they miss by not using a Realtor who knows what he/she is doing. You can always buy a house but did you buy the one that best fits your needs or did you buy at the best price possible. "Buy-It-Yourselvers" or "FSBOs" think that they save money but there is plenty of evidence that (1) people who buy on their own tend to overpay because they were not aware of the other competitive offerings and (2) that people who sell on their own get less and take longer to sell their property than if they had used a Realtor.

Sun Mar 30 2008, 02:19

I have had the experience of having had a parent in real estate (Century 21), buying a home before I had my license, and buying and selling to myself and others as a licensed agent (KW). When there was no computer, people had to rely on the agent's knowledge and expertise. Some lower income and minority buyers don't understand the process of a real estate transaction. They are afraid they will be judged, or fear wasting an agents time. These are the people I am hoping to reach.
On the other hand, with the many internet websites on every subject, some people want to be an "home office" expert on everything including real estate, the stock market, travel, and medicine... They use the time at work, not doing their actual job, but trying to do my job.Yes, they can even look for a home by driving away precious gas everyday after work and every weekend. When I hear people complaining about how much Realtors cost or get paid, I wonder, did you really use an agent? did you even let the agent do the job? Or are you mad because you rode around, on your own, for six months and finally found the home yourself? Did the listing agent even let you in the house when you were unrepresented stranger? Did you submit your own offer? was your phone offer taken seriously? Did you buy a contract on the internet or the office supply store? These are all scenarios experienced when dealing with the unrepres