And there's the catch. If the buyer is working with a lender and it becomes very obvious that they do not understand the entire payment, agents aren't supposed to go over that? Then we're stepping on someone's toes? What about items like the survey, home warranty, appraisal, title insurance? 9 times out of ten we're the ones walking buyers through these many of these items, having them sign the mandatory disclosures stating that we DID go over these items with them but we're not supposed to ask to review the gfe to see if the items are included already? There's a survey or some other bill that wasn't poc'd but not on the gfe that shows up at closing, etc. GFE's vary - some lenders include everything on them and some lenders include very little. Some lowball estimates on home owner's insurance and taxes and some give fair estimates. It's usually the agent who is at the closing table when the final numbers come in higher than the buyer expected. Thank goodness that I do have a lot of great lenders that i've worked with who are very good at explaining things but it is a very confusing process and seeing that we can be showing property to someone for months before we go to contract, we need to know enough to know how an increase in mortgage rates will effect payments. Interest rates go up and we need may need to negotiate more cc's to buy the rate back down. In a perfect world every gfe would be identical and all costs would be included. It shouldn't be hard for the first agent mentioned above to come up with a list of several good lenders.

If the mortgage broker cannot accurately and properly go over the GFE with the client themselves then they need to find another line of work. Its not the Realtors job to have to do this.

Explaining the FULL payment and closing costs is the mortgage brokers job, period. However, of course going over seller concessions and loan amount they qualify for is imperative, the Realtor shouldn't have to get any more involved than that, anymore and you are stepping on the mortgage brokers toes and risk confusing the client with 2 voices in their head possible telling different info. Not Good.

I won't write an offer without a good faith estimate and at least a pre-approval letter from a lender to go with it. We need this information. Why do many agents insist on having it? Because we've had buyers either go to contract or get to the closing table and be shocked that they need $5k more to close or didn't know that owners title or the cost of the survey was not included. Or mistakenly think that the principle and interest was their only payment and forget to figure in the tax and insurance portions. The lender should have had your ok, though, just to keep you in the loop as to who they were communicating with. If you were referred to them by an agent, they may have assumed so. I would just call and clarify that with them. It shouldn't have any personal information on it, tho.

When trying to get concessions from a seller, knowing what the closings costs are going to be is very important. Sometimes, there is money left over from what the seller has agreed to pay and if we did not see the gfe to begin with, there is no place to apply that money to and we can't just give it back to you at closing - it has to be used in conjunction with the sale. If I know how much my buyers need to close but more closing costs are available, I can write the contract with wording that allows for excess to be applied in different ways.

I like to have a good faith on hand when showing property so buyers can have the payment in their head when looking at the property.

I must have missed some of the rest of the thread because some of it is really off topic!

Its funny because a lot of agents will call and demand a copy of the GFE from the loan agent. I dont know if its to "make sure" the client is getting a "good deal" or what, but I always thank them for asking and wanting to help in the process but tell them I cannot send them a copy without the borrowers permission.

Then I would ask why they want it and just let them know I have gone over it with the client and they are all clear on the fees and there wont be any surprises.

what a great thread.

i'm with the guys from CA. i'm sure they know what is really going on, they are taking it in the shorts out there and they have the most regulations.

i would stay away from people like donald keys. he professes it is not standard of practice then reccomends you do the very thing he just recommended against.

what a flake

arizona needs a deeper bench in their real estate and loan dept

oh no my broker showed my gfe to my agent should i get a lawyer?

asinine

blind leading blind

This is rich! One guy says to complain to the state Real Estate board to report a good loan agent sharing fees and costs to the Realtor he or she is working with on a deal and another lady says to find another Realtor and be afraid of interest only loans and adjustable rate mortgages. WOW! The best part of Kathy's answer was about not accepting a pre-payment penalty. THEY DON"T REALLY MAKE THOSE ANYMORE!

It almost feels like if Randy Hooker and Linda can have their competition reported to the State authorities, they will have less competition. That is the kind of swindler you can trust - NOT! I am sure these sanctimonious wolves dry clean their sheep costumes daily.

Yeah sure, find another Realtor, like Linda or the Hooker guy, and then you'll be fine. They will never share any info with their loan agent - BECAUSE THEY PROBABLY DO THEIR OWN LOANS SO THEY CAN DOUBLE OR TRIPLE END THE DEAL AND REALLY HARM YOU MR. or MRS. BUYER!

WANT ONE REALLY GOOD PIECE OF INFORMATION - IF YOUR AGENT OR BROKER CLAIMS TO BE ABLE TO DO ANY TYPE OF FHA OR HUD LENDING AND AT THE SAME TIME PRACTICES REAL ESTATE OR HAS REAL ESTATE PRACTICING OUT OF HIS OR HER OFFICE - THEY ARE BREAKING THE LAW!!!!

Your agent and broker should be in the same loop. Stay away from the shysters on this site. The do not know what they are talking about and have their own best interests at heart. NOT YOURS!

REMEMBER!
1. FHA/HUD means you must be a W-2's employee of a HUD approved bank and MUST NOT practice real estate.
2. The GFE has no personal information, just rate and fee information that will HELP your Realtor write a better offer on your behalf.
3. Any agent that wants to stab another agent in the back will do the same thing to you for money.
4. If an agent sells a house and does the loan, they CANNOT do FHA or HUD loans.
5. You are not in control, the agent and loan broker is, that is why they are there. They are the professionals. Let them work.
6. Desperation breeds corruption. Those who do something and tell you about it, doesn't mean the liars and back stabbers won't do the same thing, it just means that the thief will do it and just NOT TELL YOU!

a lender is required to supply a good faith estimate to interested buyers within 3 days of the request. I don't know why the agent received your estimate. Find another realtor, interview lenders by asking them to provide you with a TIL (Truth in Lending statement) on the amount of the loan you are requesting. Then compare the interest rate to the interest rate they are offering you. The closest they are will show you what and who is taking the fees. Make sure the loan has NO PREPAYMENT PENALTY, that it is not an "interest only loan", and is not an "adjustable rate mortgage". Good Luck.

This is not a red flag at all and does not seem to be anything other than the loan agent trying to give the Realtor an idea of what their potential buyer qualifies for. The loan agent did not give the Realtor the 1003 (loan app) which contains the buyers personal info. The loan agent merely let the Realtor know how strong of an offer he or she might be able to write on behalf of the buyer. It is called working together for an ungrateful and paranoid non-buyer who feels safer sitting on the fence than they do dealing with a team of people working for them. The good faith estimate will provide the rate and fees that the deal will include and if you don't like it, go get with a loan broker who doesn't give a good faith at all so you can really get ripped off.

This market is tough enough without having to deal with potential problem buyers who fell like everyone in our industry is out to get them. We are trying to survive this meltdown and we have new regulations and rules being handed down by HUD and Treasury and our lenders every day and compliance can be very difficult to stay current with. The good faith estimate is exactly that - GOOD FAITH! It must be nice being in the driver's seat as a buyer. Now you can contribute to this market absolutely freezing solid by year's end, and then you'll get nothing at all. Nothing except for a ton of paperwork that means nothing other than the fact that you will get nothing but an opportunity to stand in line to bid on a crap property that you don't qualify for since your buying competition is a cash buyer with no contingencies. Then, when you lose the property to the cash buyer you can turn around and blame the loan agent and the Realtor and everyone else, just to fulfill your paranoid illusions of our struggling industry. Yeah it's a red flag all right...a red flag about YOU! If I was your loan agent, know that I don't get paid until YOUR DEAL CLOSES... and if I read this ridiculous question, I would fire your butt and let you go with someone who would lie to you and your poor Realtor. Get a clue and stop your whining and paranoid behavior. It is offensive and hurtful. We work hard. most of the time for NOTHING, and you just showed why the latter is more often the norm.

Sad!

Hi Kathy,

That is not standard practice. A loan officer that does that obviously does not hold your personal information in confidentiality. I certainly understand why loan officers do that, but this information should only be disclosed to the Buyer's Agent that you hire. So, when you do hire your Buyer's Agent and decide on the loan officer you want to be a part of your team, then your financial information should be disclosed to your Buyer's Agent, who will review it for any thing that would appear abmormal.

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PAUL WELDEN
HomeSmart
480-241-0081
Buyer's Agent Realtor

Kathy, this does not sound like "normal" standards of practice, unless the REALTOR is also working as a LOAN OFFICER or an EMPLOYEE of the mortgage broker.

You are free to choose ANY LENDER or any REALTOR to represent you in your home purchase and are not required to use any specific company or agent.

I do suggest when you do hire a REALTOR that they DO take a look at your G.F.E. and make sure that your fees and charges are not excessive. I also suggest that you shop your loan to at least 3 different places (mortgage brokers or mortgage bankers).

Just an FYI, mortgage brokers and bankers should be regulated by the Arizona Department of Finance.

I hope this helps.

Happy home hunting.

Peoria, AZ Bank Repos - http://www.PeoriaAZRepos.com
Free list with pictures updated daily.

I agree with Randy H.

Not a normal "standard" practice.

Hey Kathy...

To answer your question directly and succinctly, No, that it is not standard practice. I would file a complaint with the violating lender, and I would probably be extremely cautious about dealing with the Loan Officer that did that. In my language, "Not cool!"

By the way, there are several excellent Buyer's Brokers that are active on Trulia, so perhaps you would want to consider one of them to be your Realtor.

All the best!

...randy

Randy Hooker
Buyer's Broker