Agent had a bad day or could there be other circumstances?

I have only rejected one offer and it was because it was a bank-owned property and we had a multiple offer situation. Three offers (at asking and above asking price) were actively being considered and negotiated and then an offer about $25000 below asking price came in. Prior to these 3 offers being considered, we've had 7 other offers. Because of the multiple offer situation and buyers were already frantic and panicky and the bank was trying to decide on an offer, the new one that came in was just not competitive enough to submit and would seem like a frivolous act, so it was not submitted. When that was determined, I immediately contacted the agent who submitted the offer, but she did not respond. My guess is that she also thought it was a low offer.

Your offer did not seem too low. Did you get a reason? No recourse. Submit another offer if you really like the house and ask what your chances are. Having a family member represent you should not make a difference.

Fri May 2 2008, 23:19

Jeremy, good evening ...

You did everything right, but welcome to real estate 101 ...

The real estate "negotiation" system is very flawed - and always has been .. it's just that things are just finally catching up to a system that was obsolete 10 years ago.

Stop and think about for a moment ... you the buyer, is hiring a stranger to do the negotiation .. the offer is going to be transported via a 2 minute phone call and a fax -- where's the negotiation part.?

The listing agent receives it and will send it, and discuss it with the seller over another 2 minute phone call ... and the seller will make a quick decision based on all of the information that was gathered by him through the listing agent 30 days ago - and 30 minutes ago ... where's the negotiation part.? .. it's either yeah or neh, or the buyer wants another $29,000 - but you weren't there, so you don't know what was said ..

This all coming off a 7 year stint in California that most agents just haggled over the "highest" offers on a Sunday and lenders were buying dead people with a pulse -- certainly no negotiation there ... and we now know those days are over - way over.

A quality agent, a savvy negotiator would have kept the ball in play .. because if you're not in front of a buyer or a seller, then you are unemployed ... offer and counter, offer and counter, sometimes the negotiations might take 2 weeks.

In your situation the listing agent wants to be the seller - she's not - .. somewhere between $619,000 and $570,000 you and the seller you have a basis for doing business .. so I would date all the calls and meetings and time the situation with the listing agent for the broker - because she hasn't done her job.

I would then call the the seller direct and make an appointment with your agent and either you do the negotiation .. or .. have your agent do it (whatever you feel comfortable with) - but definitely leave the listing agent "out" .... they won't be the first agent that squirreled a deal, and they won't be the last...

Think about it .. he wants to sell and you want to buy - never let anyone except the seller themselves get in the way of "you" buying a home.


Good luck and let me know what happens.!


: ^)

Thu Apr 24 2008, 18:16

Good Morning Jeremy. As everyone indicated, in this market your offer should not have been considered a low ball offer and even if it was, the offer should have been negotiated. Some of my sellers would have been very excited to negotiate that offer. In the arena of buying and selling real estate, you will always have emotions involved, however, the emotions should not be that of a real estate agent. You have received some good advice here. When my sellers receive an offer they say is "an insult" it is my job as their agent to take the emotions away, I can always get that seller to start negotiations and not shut the door. An offer means the buyer wants to buy and we know the seller wants to sell - so agents need to earn the commission and get to work. If this is the house for you, have your agent have a heart to heart with the listing agent. Good Luck Jeremy.

Thu Apr 24 2008, 05:23

Hi Jeremy,

First off.... Your offer was not a low ball at any stretch and any reasonable seller would have at least provided you with a counter offer. I would be curious to know if there were any other offers received on this particular property (has it gone pending?)... in my opinion, this listing agent is not doing an adequate job in facilitating an initiation of negotiating.... being that you were only $49k apart, which could very possibly have been bridged in the counter offer stage. Unfortunately you cannot influence the seller nor the actions of the representation they've chosen in the sale of their property.

I would have your agent contact the listing agent to ensure that the offer was in fact presented to the seller. At any rate, keep an eye on the property.... if the property continues to be listed with no offers, then the seller may be inclined to reconsider negotiating on your offer.

Best of luck.... its a buyers market out there, even if some sellers and their agents don't quite understand that just yet.

Tara :)

Thu Apr 24 2008, 00:44

Jeremy......this is a Buyer's Market and it is not unusual for a Buyer to submit a low offer with the increased inventory available these days. The agent that immediately rejected the offer was not fullfilling her obligation to "present all offers" to her client. Who knows how high you might have gone? She never gave her client the chance to negotiate with you. Did your father present the offer or just fax it? It's often a good idea to present an offer in person, or at least have a letter stating your strengths as a qualitied and bonified Buyer along with comparables that substantiate your offer. This is a good starting place!

Thu Apr 24 2008, 00:25

That listing agent needs to be reprimanded! You should call that agent's broker and relate this story. That broker will be aghast at his agent's behavior. Your offer is hardly "offensive". Some agents may express their disappointment at a lower than expected offer, but they have no right to refuse to present any offer to the seller. It doesn't matter how low ball it is. It still has to be presented. Remember, though, that the Seller has every right to reject such offers. The ideal scenario would be for the dialogue to continue via counter-offers. At least both sides will be talking.

As far as the condition of the house....is the property priced to reflect the work that is needed? What do the comps show --- and I don't mean getting it from Zillow. Have you checked out other similar homes in the area? If similar homes are normally valued at $800K, this one may be priced at $619K to give allowances for upgrades.

Good luck!

Thu Apr 24 2008, 00:08

I would contact your local board of Realtors and file a complaint.

Best,
Mark Palace, CEO/Founder
Palace Properties International, Inc.
www.PalacePropertiesOnline.com
321.773.5611
321.704.9305

Wed Apr 23 2008, 20:34

Hi Jeremy,
I think the listing agent is WAY out of line. As others have said, that agent is obligated to present any and all offers to the sellers (regardless of what they told you about not accepting another offer from you). In my mind, the absolute worst insult is NO OFFER at all! I would also caution you about too much faith in a 'zestimate". At this moment in time, Zillow has far to go before it is an accurate estimator of a home's value. In my experience, its estimates are sometimes over-valued and sometimes under-valued -- rarely has it been "right on the money".

Wed Apr 23 2008, 20:14

Our job as agents is to present all offers. First of all we are not in control of the sellers reponse if they are offended. However we can consult with our sellers and let them know that the best thing to do is consider a counter offer and be as professional as we can about it. There is alot of media out there pushing the buyers into a frenzy and making it unreal as to what the market conditions really are in some areas.
We should all be happy with any offer that comes in for our seller or buyers and work dillegently and professionally to negociate it as smoothly as possible. Agents need to be professional and courteous.

Wed Apr 23 2008, 20:09

Hi Jeremy,

In this market the listing agent should be anxious to work with your offer. I think every offer is worth countering if it is not acceptable to the seller at face value. Did she even present it to the seller? It sounds like she just made the decision on her own which is totally wrong. You may want to tell your agent to ask her to have the seller to reject the offer and send it back to you.

If you are still interested in the property, you can submit an offer again and if she refuses to present it to the seller, she can get into trouble. She does not have the right to reject the offer on her own unless the seller has specifically told her he is not interested in seeing any offers below a certain amount. Even then she needs to inform him of the offer. You can certainly insist on the sellers signature on the rejected area of the contract so that you know that the seller was made aware of your offer.

It seems unbelievable that a seller would not want to work with your offer or not give you a counter offer in today's market. So don't let the listing agent intimidate you. I don't think your offer was that bad to get such a response from her. I think she may be living in the year 2003-2006 when homes were selling for more than asking price with multiple offers and this may be the only listing she has. I have seen such ridiculous offers that it is not even funny, so your offer is still decent and worth working with.

Maybe your father should call her broker and tell him about this agent.

Thanks

Meena Gujral
Help-U-Sell Achievers Realty
Fremont, Ca. 94539

Wed Apr 23 2008, 20:02

Any agent that does not present all offers to his sellers is not doing his job! It is not my job to accept offers for my clients . My job is to present the offers and advise the sellers of thier merit. My client might refuse an offer today and a week later accept an offer at the same price he refused. I do not presume to know what a seller will or will not accept. It is not the agents job to be insulted at an offer. He should behappy he has an offer to present

Wed Apr 23 2008, 19:15

Jeremy,

I am of the opinion that buyers were offended for about 5 years and now is the sellers turn. In my case I warn my sellers ahead of time not to be offended. This is not a personal issue -- it is business and as such it is about money, not personal.

I have a listing that was listed and appraised at $3M. I had a buyer, offer $1.5 (less than land value). Since I had forewarned my buyers what to expect, they were not offended. They were equally ridiculously on their counter offer. That buyer has made two more offers since and calls periodically to track the property. Neither my client or me have any problem taking money from someone who's insulting.

It is my opinion that professionals do not take anything said in a negotiation personal--unless it is a direct personal attack. There are buyers who believe that if they don't insult the seller with their offer, they probably paid too much. It is our job as professional negotiators to keep everyone focused on the deal and keep it from getting personal. Keep making your offers... there are many professional agents out there who know how to bring a buyer and seller together without getting anyone offended.

Wed Apr 23 2008, 18:54

Hi Jeremy,
I agree with some of the things already said. Laws differ in each state so I'm not sure how it is handled in CA but in Maryland, we are required by Law to present any offer that we are given even if the home is already under contract. And, even though as the Realtor representing the Seller we have a sense of what they are willing to accept, it is not up to us to make a judgement about it. However, I will say that when I represent the Seller and we receive a low offer, I do counsel my client to not make a counter offer. Remember the Listing Agent is supposed to represent their client to the best of their ability and if a counter offer is given, isn't that giving away their hand? I think it is. So, I usually will advise giving the offer back and just letting the Buyer or the Buyers Agent know that my client isn't willing to accept the offer as is but would welcome any other offers that the Buyer may want to make. In addition, I also agree about making the Listing Agents job easier by including print outs of all of the recent solds in the area and perhaps the under contract although in MD you cannot see the actual agreed sale price until after the property settles so I'm not sure how much help they would be. Care is needed to make sure that you are only including properties that would compare with the one you are trying to purchase, i.e., same number of bedrooms, bathrooms, lot size, updates, etc. I would then also attach a nice note referencing the information you have attached along with any comments you feel are relevant to the condition of the property and how much money you feel it may take for updates. If that number would price you out of the range of the homes selling in the community, it would not make sense for you and the Seller should be made aware of this if they have not been made aware already. Realtors do their best to help show Sellers the prices that compare to their property in order to help them price their property appropriately but sometimes they just believe their home is worth more and it takes time on the market to bring a sense of reality to bear. I always tell my Sellers that we can do the very best job possible in pricing the property but in the end the market is going to tell them what it is really worth. It is after all only worth what at least one person is willing to pay. And it also has to pass the appraisal test! Hope this helps.

Wed Apr 23 2008, 18:53

Hi Jeremy,
It is the listing agent's duty to present ALL offers to their seller. If they don't, they are doing their seller a gross misservice. Any offer less than 10% is not a low ball offer in this declining market.
And while there is not excuse for an agent making disparaging comments to your realtor(father), this could still work.
While there may not be "recourse", per se. Go ahead and make another offer at the same price. Included with your offer, include a local CMA indicating avg. price per square foot. Additionally, include some price bids for reasonable updating - i.e. don't get crazy with granite and travertine. Lastly, ask in writing to have a written counter or rejection from the seller. This way, you can know, positively, that the seller actually was presented the offer. Did your dad have an opportunity to present the offer in person? Sometimes a face to face dialogue between agents can help give some insight as to certain aspects of the offer.
Good Luck!

Wed Apr 23 2008, 18:49

Dear Jeremy,

I am sorry you were treated so shamefully by someone in the real estate community. The listing agent has a duty to present all offers in the best possible light. The decision whether or not to counter offer or accept is the sellers. I would re-write the offer, (new date on the contract), and submit it with a letter that makes the seller sign that they have received and read the offer.

It is not unusual for agents to get their feathers ruffled by out-of-area agents who, by looking online somewhere, think they know the local market. That is still no excuse for such behavior.

Wed Apr 23 2008, 18:47

Dear Jeremy,
We live in a world where people often miss opportunities due to poor communication skills. In my experience, I present all offers to my sellers. We discuss their goal (i.e. getting the house SOLD) and the offer. Every seller has their bottom line price. And in your situation, I think you had a decent offer for beginning the negotiation process, provided you have the financing to "Close the deal." I agree with the answer suggesting you wait out the sellers. Likewise, you can submit several offers and find a very motivated seller. In this market, you do not have to pay top dollar. Your agent will lead you through the process and help you find a good deal. Happy house hunting.

Wed Apr 23 2008, 18:37

Hi Jeremy,

Are you sure you don't want to move to Florida? I have amny sellers here that would welcome any offer !! It is a shame emotions get involved on both sides of the fence. I agree that there is plenty of inventory out there right now to chose from so you have plenty of options. Keep an eye on the house and watch to see if the sellers begin to lower there price and possibly resubmit your offer backed by comps as the other agent said. I have also had buyers